September 2008

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Osbys neighbor   |September.21.2008 Just Me Neither you or Interesting (who I think are one in the same) ever included any information about how many FFs work a 48 hour shift or what percent of the time does it occur. Are there a small group of FFs who sign up for 48 hour shifts because they want the OT and extra time off? How many FFs have been forced to take a double shift versus those who volunteer?

Tom Bosley   |September.20.2008 BIG CITY.....for the last couple of weeks I have really tried to be quite and just attempt to read what others have to say and possibly learn something knew. But you last "rant" just took the cake. You and your like are going to be the end of the blogaspheres we have all come to enjoy. Your completely, B.S. about the Rand Study just goes to prove that your like do not have any clue of what is going on in the world we live in today. You write things, like they are so factual, but you probably read them in the National Iquirer and took them as gospel. The Rand Corporation was one of the most idiotic, socialistic, think tank ever to have existed. Everything they study and reported on was bogus and so right of right and then left of left, that they lost all of the credibility in the late 1970's. You could help us all if you would get your facts straight.....You are going to be our down fall.....

An Angry Citizen   |September.20.2008 I would like to respond to the following: "24 hour shift? Try 48 hours shifts. And you expect them to stay awake? The employees can't leave their place of employment for the 48 hours. The nature of the job is that they may be on call after call after call, or they may never have to answer one call. Sorry that there isn't back to back emergencies every single day so you can feel good about Public Safety and the fact people are losing property, their lives or are having health problems. I think you ought to contact Mr. Tanner, place your complaint, and see if he thinks you are irrational also. I think that on this point, I may finally find Tanner and I agree. You and those with your stance on the work of the Fire Department, are so misinformed that you have absolutely no idea what end is up." I would like to point out, 48 hour shifts are a result of the fire department wanting it that way as per their negotiations. Why would anyone in their right mind agree to that? Because they spend 90% of their time NOT responding to calls. How else can these people have second jobs. We don't let operators work over 16 hours by law, regardless of the process they are monitoring due to safety concerns. Therefore, you must realize that the fire departments were able to show a great amount of downtime to rest, otherwise it would undoubtedly be illegal. It would be a good time to place them on eight or twelve hour rotating shifts and get rid of the beds at the fire stations. I would recommend eight, that way they aren't so overworked. Besides, spending so much time in that recliner every day is bound to be bad for your back. We could then only give 8 hours per month for sick leave instead of 24 and reduce the overtime you get, instead of 24 hours, to a maximum of 8 per day. The moron who approved that should be placed in a nuthouse for public safety due to a lack of common sense. Thes people work a lot fewer days than the rest of us due to 24 hour shifts and are therefore less likely to be sick on a workday, yet they receive three times the sick leave. Operators who work 12 hour shifts in our water department don't receive 12 hours a month, I read their contract. It is you who doesn't know which way is up JustMe, I understand you perfectly... Perhaps some of our citizens now understand better, also. We all need to understand, the fight isn't just with public safety members, it is with their families and even some of their friends, although I know of more than one friendship that has been tainted, even ruined by this mess.

Big City   |September.20.2008 On Fire---- Like I mentioned previously, you can expect public safety department bosses to be ADVOCATES for their "troops" and NOT no-nonsense, no-excuses managers that demand hard work and efficiency. As I previously described, Vallejo (and most other cities) need an INTENSIVE and COMPREHENSIVE time-and-motion and efficiency study performed by COMPETENT, INDEPENDENT, KNOWLEDGEABLE experts. I can guarantee you that they will find MASSIVE inefficiency in these departments EVEN NOW with their "short-staffing" and they absolutely won't find ANY of these employees overworked. Quite the contrary, in fact. What has developed in most public safety departments is a PRIMADONNA SYNDROME. BIG TIME! This condition infects most departments THOROUGHLY and DEEPLY. It's at the root of a whole host of other problems that manifest themselves and that we get to read about in the newspaper most every day. The public is to blame for all this, though. For too long, public safety departments have been showered with excessive pay and benefit increases and a whole host of other things. They have been held accountable for nothing. If they fail, they simply say it's because we're underpaid, overworked, and have poor morale. The public buys this, accepts their failures, and showers them with what they ask for. For some reason the public, at large, equates these folks with their TV and movie counterparts. That's NOT how it is. For example, many years ago the Rand Corporation, a high-powered and authoritative research organization, did a comprehensive study to determine the effectiveness of INVESTIGATIVE divisions in police departments. They found that investigative divisions were virtually a total waste of time and effort. VERY few crimes were solved as a result of the work of detectives. They stated that, by-and-large, crimes were solved by information provided to the beat officer that initially responded to the incident by on-scene witnesses. If that didn't occur, the crimes were rarely subsequently solved. They suggested in the report that police departments would be much better served by either disbanding their investigation divisions or drastically reducing their size and re-assigning the personnel involved to patrol duty. I think you will find that the above-referenced study was COMPLETELY IGNORED and forgotten by virtually every police department in the country. Of course, if it had concluded that investigation divisions ought to be better paid and greater staffed, that would definitely have been taken seriously. Why? Very simple. Uniformed officers usually want to get out of patrol work. The hours are bad, the days off out-of-sync with most working folks, and they're on the front-line. They would much rather work a mostly "day job" with mostly weekends off. They also like to operate in "plain clothes". It gives them a lot more freedom to do whatever they want. So, investigation divisions offer patrol officers a chance to "get off the beat" and into a "cushy" slot where they can emulate Kojak. So, it's not in the interest of the troops to see investigation divisions eliminated or down-sized. Therefore, the conclusions of the Rand Corporation study are completely ignored. As I mentioned before, it's what's good for the troops that comes first, NOT what's good for the community they serve.

On Fire   |September.20.2008 Didn't we just hear the police chief complaining about his dept. having to do more with less and how tired they all were from being over worked and how they were unhappy because other cities had new shiney toys and we didn't? Yet there was a motor scooter competition in front of city hall this morning with at least three patrol cars sitting and watching, and a number of our motor scooter cops riding in and out of orange cones? Now if there are not enough cops to patrol the city, who was doing just that while the ones were turning circles downtown? Were the ones that were "on duty" being paid overtime while filling in for the ones riding in competition? What about the ones in the patrol cars? Were they there on their own time using city vehicles? Aren't the police complaining about worn out vehicles, yet they can use them to drag race and ride around orange cones? None of this makes any sense considering the complaining Nichelini did last week. Where is the leadership at Amador Street?

JustMe   |September.20.2008 Yes, it was me. Excuse the error in the postings under Osby's Neighbor. The posting was directed to O.N., but had a family emergency to deal with and happened to send before I could correct the "name". I had realized my mistake while composing the post, meant to correct the error, but poop happens. The post however is the answer to Osby's Neighbor and still stands as that.

Osbys Neighbor   |September.20.2008 For the record ,the person who used my name two posts below is most likely JustMe.

RdP   |September.20.2008 WaR posted the following in the August Scream: "YOUR LIES HAVE FINALLY BEEN SUNSHINE!" (Mayor Exline 199 V. NOTICE OF APPEAL Page 16 (CONCLUSION 4-19) Even You Guys Cannot Believe These Two Paragraphs Of Blathering Denial Are Going To Fool Anyone... Let Alone A Judge Who's Established Reputation And Proficiency As Much As The One That Definitely Proceeds Judge McManus. Do Your Homework And Check His 99% Record, When Others Have Been Asked To Give Their Personal Testimonials Regarding The Honorable Judge McManus They read As such, "Integrity You Can Rely On!" plus "His Justice For All Attitude Exceeds All Others'." in addition to "Judge Michael McManus' Painstaking Thoroughness While Seeking Out ALL Facts During and To a Trial's End, There's Hardly Been Anyone Who's Ever Questioned or Second-Guessed His Final Judgment!" Finally! We've Been Blessed To Get An Out-0f-Town Judge With True Integrity, Who'll NOT Be, Bought, Bullied Nor Intimidated. Long Ago Many of Us Knew We Were Being Driven Down This Horrific Path Into Bankruptcy By These Tyrants, But, Most of Us Never Gave Up Faith That A Savior To Our Plight Would Someday Bring Back Hope By Returning Vallejo to "US" It's Citizens!!! Tom Bosley

Osbys Neighbor   |September.20.2008 24 hour shift? Try 48 hours shifts. And you expect them to stay awake? The employees can't leave their place of employment for the 48 hours. The nature of the job is that they may be on call after call after call, or they may never have to answer one call. Sorry that there isn't back to back emergencies every single day so you can feel good about Public Safety and the fact people are losing property, their lives or are having health problems. I think you ought to contact Mr. Tanner, place your complaint, and see if he thinks you are irrational also. I think that on this point, I may finally find Tanner and I agree. You and those with your stance on the work of the Fire Department, are so misinformed that you have absolutely no idea what end is up.

On Fire   |September.19.2008 This should be no suprize that kinky henke had to try and save face. I'm sure with all of the pressure from the national front, they couldn't help themselves. The judge laid out the union's argument line by line. He said that they didn't submit evidence to support their case. What is there to appeal? The only thing they could argue now is to do exactly what their union said: "Cut till it hurts"! "Cut till the public feels the hurt and will be forced to approve a new tax". So since there is nothing left, guess IBEW better make plans to revise their resumes. henke would love to cut every member of CAMP. The unions want cityhall closed down, further cuts in service, close down the libraries, close the parks and community centers, close down the museum and tax the hell out of the citizens. This from our PS employees who signed on to serve and protect. Serve their own self interest, and protect their contracts. SSDD!

Vallejo Taxpayer   |September.19.2008 Training and recruitment...Hahaha. Chief Nicky doesn't want to do that because it might actually improve his police department. And we know he doesn't want that because he has to support his union buddies and make the people of vallejo suffer and live in fear so they'll cave and support their crazy salaries and benefits. He should take his condescending smarmy fake charm and large ego back to Oakland (if they'd take him).

NPD   |September.19.2008 It's got to be Henke's ego taking over again. That's the only thing that would make them be so stupid. Narcisistic Personality Disorder. He just can't face the fact that he lost. And he lost in a BIG way on an international stage and everybody is looking at him and laughing. The emperor has no clothes, and it's not a pretty pink site. Gordon and that IBEW guy (why can't anybody remember his name? Irrelevancy will do that I guess) need to snap out of the Henke trance and realize they're being led by the nose down a bad path.

On Fire   |September.19.2008 Okay, so how does this work? You have the unions who have admitted that they NOW know that the city is indeed BANKRUPT. Then they send an email out, just this week, stating that the city is bankrupt and because they have taken cuts in salaries, they have "done their Part" and now waiting to hear from the City. Then today, we find out that they had filed an appeal. How many ways can you say liars, hypocrites, racketeers? They knew when they sent the email out, that they were in the process of filing their appeal. So why didn't they just say this in their email? Why were they hiding it? Because that's how they operate. Smoke and Mirrors, half truths, just plain out and out liars. How do they now sit down at the table and negotiate...in good faith? How do they convey honesty in what they say? How can anyone believe anything they say? Forget about having money for recruitments and training. Forget about incentives to keep the employees here. That just flew out the window for additional attorney's fees and court costs. Like we said from the very beginning, why bother to entertain any discussion that comes out of the sock puppet's mouth? Just tell them to send in their best offer, and wait on Dec. I hope the judge moves the date forward because allowing time for bogus negotiations is a waste of time and money. Just make the decision and move on. And oh yes, DO NOT FEED TARTUFFE TROLLS. Like rodents, it just encourages them to hang around.

Next Generation   |September.19.2008 What about my generation??

Osbys Neighbor   |September.19.2008 Don't assume I can't do math or statistics. I did realise that FFs work 2.33 shifts per week. 1)Most professions don't allow you to sleep on the job .Please don't tell me that there aren't slow periods in most 24 hour shift. A person working in San Francisco spends at least 3 hours each day commuting so their real day is 11 or 12 hours not 8. 2) Go to the City's HR site and you will see that FFs holiday pay is calculated as OT--9.5 shifts is 4.1 weeks off vs 2.6 weeks for non FFs. 3)The size of the healthcare stipend a teacher gets (if they don't use the VSDs healthcare) is peanuts compared to the $500 a month FFs and Police receive. 4)The 3%@50 occured because the PSU,CMs and City Council had no quams about spending other peoples money. By the time someone would see the effects of the City contributing 28% of a PSUs employees wages to PERs they were long gone. They left a finanical disaster for the next generation to deal with. JUSTME,you need to do better job researching the facts.To date many of them are not true.

Sonic Toad   |September.19.2008 Oh spare me, please inform me then how much of all that time at the firehouse is productive? I would like a full breakdown of how much time is spent sleeping, eating, fighting fires, paramedic calls, and remember to include Nintendo and Playstation.

JustMe   |September.19.2008 Osby's Neighbor, Considering the fact a firefighter is on duty for approximately 240 hours a month, and an 8 hour a day job amounts to 160 hours, it appears you maybe one of the 42% that dropped out if you can't figure out that a firefighter is scheduled to be at the firehouse 80 hours longer each month than the 40 hour a week employee. Teachers do not have to stay on campus for a full 8 hours, many, many contracts only require them to be on campus 15 minutes after the last bell. I asked Ms. Sweeney if this was the case with her contract and am awaiting an answer. One month off for holidays? What are you talking about? Firefighters receive "holiday pay" that is a contracted amount they receive because their schedules might require they work on a holiday. They don't make time and a half, or double time, because they are working on a holiday such as Christmas or 4th of July, it is considered regular time. The only time they receive overtime is when they are there beyond their shift work, replacing another worker on their regularly scheduled days off. The health care scam is just that. If a teacher does not use the health care provided by the district they receive a stipend from the district for a portion of that premium the district doesn't have to pay.(i.e., if the premium would have cost the district 1000. a month and the teacher decides not to use the health care, she may an amount say, 400 for not using it.)Sort of I'm so glad you didn't cost us a 1000 dollars here's 400, thank you. She's getting paid for nothing, literally. Again, I've asked Ms. Sweeney if this is the case and haven't received an answer. The 3@50 is a contracted item. I'm quite sure if the Teachers Union could get this, there would no hesitation. They just haven't been as lucky as Public Safety. And do you believe that if this was an already contracted item for them, they would roll over and hand it over? Please, if you believe that then you need more help than the 42% of the dropouts.

Stupid Waste   |September.19.2008 Let's get this straight. Henke, Gordon and that IBEW lapdog just sent an open letter to Vallejo residents three days ago (1) confirming that the City is bankrupt and (2) telling us that they'd "done what they could" to put Vallejo back on track. Three days later they file a snowball's-chance-in-hell appeal that will cost the city MORE money to defend. How is that "putting the city back on track"? And how could they agree we were bankrupt in this letter, then appeal the bankruptcy three days later saying the city isn't bankrupt? Ahhhh...make up your minds, PSUers! Or has Cheryl been at it again? Their constant gratuitous speaking out of two sides of their mouths is getting tiring. But I'm sure Judge McManus will love this when he votes to tear up their beloved contracts in December. Hello CalFire! And how about the County Sheriff to provide police services? And an ambulance company for medical? Don't they get it? Their threats and intimidation and public bullying mean almost nothing now. That used to work. But not now. Their once loud roar has been reduced to the squeak of a mouse. Stupid waste of money. Stupid.

Me Too   |September.19.2008 Just Me wouldn't last a DAY in Vallejo High.

On Fire   |September.19.2008 More bull from the unions. They have filed an appeal of the ruling. http://www.ci.vallejo.ca.us/uploads/712/091908%20-%20Motion%20for%20Leave%20to%20Appeal%20filed%20in%20Bankruptcy%20Case.pdf

Osbys Neighbor   |September.19.2008 JUST ME With one month off for holidays,4.8 weeks for sickness and 5.2 weeks of vacation, Fire Fighters don't work much more than Teachers. While teachers pay $300 to $400 per month for health insurance PSU members get it free. The teachers health plan is not good as yours and I bet they don't get back $5,652 each year PSU employees receive if you don't use the City's plan. And then theres that little matter of 3@50 that costs the City between $28,000 and $45,000 per year for each PSU employee. I guess she didn't understand that you aren't being compensated fairly compared to a Teacher.

On Fire   |September.19.2008 The tartuffe trolls keep insisting that our employees are all fleeing to other cities where they offer shiney new toys and more candy money. Well, maybe they should read the financials instead of spending their day blogging on the times horrid. According to the Bloomberg report: A survey of goeverment fiance officersby the National League of Cities in Washington found that 64 percent of cities are less able to meet their fiscal needs now than in 2007. "For cities that are facing binding arbitration requirements and their public safety costs are higher than they feel they can afford, the Vallejo situation might signal a new strategy cities might use to push for renegotiation of those contracts, said Chris Hoene, the league's director of policy and research. So the grass may be greener today, but the drought is spreading.

On Fire   |September.19.2008 Collette, as long as you pay the salaries of city employees, you can voice your opinions all you want, any time you want. Teachers should be respected and paid a whole lot more than they do. You teach and care for our most precious treasures, our future generation. When I think about the fact that you have to come out of your pocket to buy supplies for the kids, and consider that the henkettes wine and dine, socialize, put claims in for educational incentives and have it signed off by the police chief, cause the city to expend hundreds of thousands of dollars just to appease the union heads all on our dime, I get outraged too. Then you have these same union sock puppets trying to put down others because they choose to voice their opinion on how their tax dollars are spent. They say they took a cut in pay so they have done their share to put the city back on track? I think McManus is going to be derailing that "track" the unions are on. All aboard! Either get on board or move out of the way! Viva Vallejo!

Firebug   |September.19.2008 Excellent letter Collette and remember when a PSU troll posts on VIB you have enraged a PSU crybaby definitely a win for you!

JustMe   |September.19.2008 Collette, It's a shame you'll have to call the VPD, as much as you despise them, to file a report against the person who held a gun to your head to take that low-paying teaching job. Please stop the whining Dearie, your lousy attitude will pollute the 58% of the kids who decide to stay in school in Vallejo. You only have to work 180 days a year, get a week at Thanksgiving, 2 weeks at Winter Break another week at Spring Break, Veterans Day, Cesar Chavez Day Martin Luther King Day, Presidents Day and Memorial Day off, with a few minimum days and staff development/no kids days, thrown in for whatever reason. Many contract do not require the teacher to be on campus for what would amount to an 8 hour day, does yours? Do you have built in prep periods, and do you get paid for after hour events with comp time or salary? Don't you also get a monthly stipend from the District for the amount of health insurance if you don't enroll your family? If this is the case, you're getting paid not to have health insurance. In that event, sounds like you can't point to UBL as you are being handed tax dollars for something you don't earn or even want. Collette, while you have the right to be angry, make sure it's for the right reasons. And really try and work on that resentment against your job and its salary, it would make your life a whole lot easier.

momster   |September.19.2008 sorry...I met here's a "story" I was doing two things at once.

momster   |September.19.2008 Here's a litter about Napa: 1981/82 I my mother's Napa friends said, "Don't send you daughter to VHS...it's bad." So we gave my grandmother's American Canyon address to attend Vintage. The school was great; however, I was greeted by individuals wearing cowboy hats...They called me "ni***er lover" and handed me a KKK business card. The next day my locker was broken into and everything in it was vandalized. I reported to the school officials. Two months later I was told I could no longer attended Vintage anymore has I was out of district. I enrolled at Vallejo and never had a problem at that school. Yes, Vallejo has always had a bad rap. At Vintage I saw more drug activity then I saw Valljeo High. In prividge cities they suppress their problems. In fact, in Marin they are the one of the highest in teen acholol abuse. They are one of the highest for teen prescribition drugs usage, they have eating disorder task force, and you never hear about the High school coaches, and swim teachers, and doctors lewd acts against the children. It's b/c the media is racist. Heaven forbid if their affluent cities' halo is tarnished.

Tom P.   |September.19.2008 Very good article on BK: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=aqWd7jl_aVAk&refer=home Love this line from IAFF National: "What does a bankruptcy judge know about how many fire fighters you need to arrive on a scene and how much time it takes to attack a fire and execute a rescue?" Well, the judge isn't deciding that. He's deciding on whether we can renegotiate our contracts, which will affect pay scales, not staffing levels. Besides, IAFF loves an arbitrator's deciion on staffing levels, and arbitrators are not firefighter experts. What's the difference? I'm so tired of their spin and lies. How do they sleep at night?

Tom P.   |September.19.2008 Waz Up: that would be called recruitment, and the Police Chief doesn't believe in that. He wants to let the police ranks keep falling so they can scare the public and blame bankruptcy for our crime rates. And apparently, all other agencies, except Oakland, produce poor quality officers. Not sure how that works when we got stuck with his son, who came from Oakland with disciplinary and HUGE attitude problems.

WAZ UP WID DAT   |September.19.2008 We need to start advertising our Fire and Police open postions to other states. They will appreciate the great pay and would be able to afford a nice house in a nicer area of Vallejo right now. A few weeks back I read a eatery review on yelp.com A local Vallejeon was complaining about a certain area that an eatery was located in, a new comer wrote back "that area's nadda problem, I'm from the Bronx, and Vallejo is no Bronx." I thought, that says it all, Vallejo continues to get a bad rap, because it serves the purposes of the PSU's. Our up valley neighbors like to blame as much of their crime on Vallejo as well. Leon Garcia is running for second term Mayor, and addressed American Canyons increase in crime as committed by "outsiders" and by being in the "backyard of Vallejo." He has his nerve, as do the rest of the Napa Valley. If you want to see how biggoted they are you can read the blogs of the napa register...

WAZ UP WID DAT   |September.19.2008 "YOU CAN FOOL SOME OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME, YOU CAN FOOL ALL OF THE PEOPLE SOME OF THE TIME, BUT YOU CANT FOOL ALL OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME." THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF "FOOLING" AROUND BY THE PSU'S FOR SOME TIME, THE SLEEPING FOOL HAS AWOKEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Big City   |September.18.2008 You'll find that the management, including the chiefs, in most police and fire departments are usually far more supportive of the "troops" and their desires than they are interested in what's really good for the city and the citizens thereof. After all, most of these folks have "come up through the ranks". They are steeped in the "traditions" of public safety organizations and one of those "traditions" is what's good for the troops comes first. Besides, the higher the salary and benefits the troops get, the higher their salaries are pushed. The more personnel they can get the city to buy, all the more justification for a raise for them (more staff = more responsibility and more responsibility = higher salary, don't you know?). You will almost always find that public safety department management is in "lock step" with the troops---they don't manage the troops, they are their advocates. Management and the troops will always talk about putting their lives on the line when they serve the public. That's true, but so do many other folks who are not paid anywhere near what most public safety employees are paid. If you look at job mortality statistics, you will find that police and fire positions are not really that dangerous, at all. Miners and convenience store clerks, for example, have higher mortality stats. They serve the public, too, and they are not paid anywhere near what public safety employees are paid. Another thing is that if you look at "job injury" cases in most police and fire departments, you will find that most injuries do not occur while "fighting it out" with vicious criminals or fighting fires. They are much more "mundane" sort of things. Many involve the sort of injuries that cannot be "independently verified". In other words, they are the sort of injuries that a doctor has to rely on WHAT HE IS TOLD by the employee. Another little known fact: many public safety employees go out on "disability retirements". You see, under state law (aggressively lobbied for by public safety unions), cancer is considered "presumptive" for fire personnel. This means that if a firefighter comes down with any form of cancer, it's PRESUMED to have been caused by the job. The city has to prove it was not to get out of a disability retirement. For police, stress is considered presumptive. If a doctor finds that a police officer is suffering from excessive stress, out he goes on a disability retirement. And, for stress conditions, it's mostly what the doctor is TOLD by the patient. Public safety personnel love disability retirements. Why? They get to retire even earlier than 50 with a generous retirement AND FREE OF INCOME TAXES. Pretty good deal, huh, they swill at the public trough all their lives and when they retire, they don't even have to pay income taxes.

I. Lore   |September.18.2008 Big City -- you're spot on. Many of us in the community have been saying that we should have CalFire or a private company provide fire services. It would cost at least 1/3 of what we're paying now, with lots less grief and abuse. And we had our medical services provided by an outside company up until just a few years ago. Don't know about police services, but if what I saw our Chief say on Tuesday night is correct, he doesn't get that we have to do things differently now. We can't afford his shiny toys and expensive lateral transfers anymore. Maybe "different" is another service provider. The problem is that we couldn't make that choice as a city because of our employee contracts. Unfortunately it took bankruptcy to give us options. Now either our PSU employees get a clue and negotiate affordable services, or we procure them somewhere else. Your final words are very appropriate: "necessity is the mother of invention. You currently have necessity---in spades." Got that Chief Nic? We're living in different times than your glory days of 1995. Get on the bus or get out of the way.

Big City   |September.18.2008 I think that the City of Vallejo should strongly consider other, more creative and efficient options for providing public safety service. There are many possibilities to consider. A few: 1) contract out fire service to another agency such as the county fire department or state fire department; 2) contract out fire service to a private company. Such companies exist; 3) contract out police service to another agency such as the county sheriff's department; 4) contract out ALL medical response to a private company, eliminating it from fire department responsibility. Then, drastically reduce the fire department. The vast majority of "fire calls" are medical in nature, anyway. So, it would be FAR more efficient and provide better service to utilize private ambulance services to deliver the medical responses and use a drastically slimmed down fire department only for actual fires and similar emergencies. Besides possible cost savings, the contracts could call for PERFORMANCE STANDARDS. Vallejo doesn't have that now. What you have is a system in which crime, medical emergencies, fires, etc. work to the advantage of the public safety unions. Instead of being ACCOUNTABLE for their failures and inefficiencies, they simply blame it on lack of staff, lack of pay, lack of benefits, poor morale, etc. They have been working this angle for years and that's a big part of what's gotten you to where you are today. With the current system, the employees have a contract that says what the city WILL DO FOR THEM. However, the city has no contract providing what the employees will do for the city beyond their being "present-and-accounted-for" (and, sometimes, not even that). With a contract with another agency or company, you have ACCOUNTABILITY through the contract. If they don't perform to the contract standards, you fire that agency or company and find another. If it's decided to keep the current city-operated public safety operations, then other things could be done to make them more efficient. Some suggestions: 1) Have a COMPREHENSIVE efficiency and time-and-motion study done of all city departments by an INDEPENDENT, outside firm. NOT "public safety-type" consultants, either. They will be "trojan horses" more interested in supporting the claims of the public safety personnel than acting in the city's interest. Use INDUSTRIAL ENGINEERS to determine just what work is actually being done BY THOROUGHLY ANALYZING THE OPERATIONS OF THE DEPARTMENTS to determine just how much WASTED TIME and EFFORT there exists. Also, to determine just how many operations, procedures and practices are non-productive. I think you'll be absolutely amazed at what a LEGITIMATE, COMPETENT, and THOROUGH analysis will reveal. Up to now, you've been basing your operations on what public safety personnel tell you. I can absolutely guarantee you that, at some level, EVERYTHING THEY TELL YOU has its roots in SELF-INTEREST. Practices, procedures, or operations that might be very beneficial for the city but detrimental to the personnel "will never see the light of day". EVER, EVER. Those will remain a well-kept secret within the organizations. Another thought: how about a COMBINED police and fire department. Sunnyvale has been doing it for 35+ years and it's worked for them. I think you'd be better served by the options I described in the first part of this response, but if you wish to keep in-house public safety operations, I think the COMBINED departments make a lot more sense than what you (and most other cities) have now. Remember, "necessity is the mother of invention". You currently have necessity---in spades.

Firebug   |September.18.2008 I would be mad too if I put that kind of money out to buy and election, put out even more money for the Rose report and BK lawyers that lost my case in court, with Judge McManus' finger on the proverbial trigger ready to tear up my fat contracts. Lots of angry PSU folks out there right now.

On Fire   |September.18.2008 Apparently I missed something that Nichelini said on Tuesday. For some reason the ps groupies are all in a twitter about Nichelini's plan. Huh? He offered some opinions that even he didn't sound convinced about, and then went on to say he was beginning to see that his way of thinking wasn't working anymore for the dept. and that maybe he had to look at things another way. Okay, so if this current model of what he has been using "isn't working" wouldn't you be asking other cities/police chief's what has worked for them? Wouldn't that be part of "the plan"? The groupies are all out drinking the blue kool-aid and only looking to keep some score on who said what and ragging on the Council. Yet not a one is upset that their funded four have opened their mouths to make any suggestions or offer an opinion. Guess you don't get your monies worth now days.

VHS   |September.18.2008 Glad to hear the land trust properties will pay the full taxes Diana. I will be interested in learning more about the program.

Diana Lang   |September.18.2008 Thank you Marc for being at the Community Land Trust and showing so much interest in this innovative potential solution to some of our affordable housing needs. As anyone familiar with the over-arching issue of affordable housing knows, there is no one solution. Hopefully there are many options to satisfy the diverse needs of any community. I wanted to address VHS's concern. A community land trust is not a housing project. It will be single family homes spread throughout the city and each of the buyers will be paying property tax. There will be plenty of opportunities to address concerns. First comes the feasibility study then a presentation at council then public meetings.

VHS   |September.18.2008 I would not be in favor of this latest low income housing project if there are any property tax discounts available to the units. So many of our existing affordable housing units pay zero or lowered property taxes as it is. This is a double blow to our local economy because at the same time the low income residents often (not always) require a disproportionately large amount of public services.

confused   |September.18.2008 collette, you picked your career as did they. sorry you hate your pay....but again you picked it !!!

MISSMARVELOUS   |September.18.2008 Once again "Little Old Lady" is "right on." Everything has a "trickle down affect, Vallejo is a prime example of every social program being abused and "gone wrong." Our programs and funding have been used against us by outside investors (aka slumlords) and by out of town city staffers. Our most precious assets instead of being protected and preserved, have been filled with low income housing by slum lords who could care less about improving or protecting their property. Little Old Lady is right, so far our city only serves the poor, we need to do something to attract the middle class to move here and stay here, as the middle class pays most of the taxes as we all know. If we ignore the middle class, they will start to move away (some all ready have.)

Rick Mariani   |September.17.2008 Collette, YOU GO GIRL! Excellent!!!!

Truth Teller   |September.17.2008 Collette, you are so very right and righteous in your letter. Thank you for clearly stating your distaste and anger for these self-interested, out of touch, greedy unions bosses. Shame should be heaped upon them by their respective membership. And from what I've heard - that is starting to happen. Thank you again!

Kirk   |September.17.2008 It's easier, and in their best interest, to blame the incompliant council and City Manager. Same intimidation tactics as years past, it's just not working anymore. That's primarily because the PSU'S cant bleed anything more from the turnip no matter how many people they helped elect. I hope "Eat Crow" has been sent to the TH editor!

Curious   |September.17.2008 I am having a hard time understanding why the PSU folks harp on blaming former City Councils for not fostering enough economic development so that they might get paid what they want now. Weren't those the same City Council members they bought and paid for? So if those folks were dumb enough to do the PSU's bidding, so how do the PSU folks think the same folks would be smart enough to create a climate for economic development and good governance? Shouldn't we be watching the puppeteers not the puppets?

YALL   |September.17.2008 Should be questioning where they got your email addresses in the first place. If any of you put your email addresses in the city of Vallejo system, i.e. paying a bill online, then somebody has taken the liberty of snatching your personal info and giving it to the city unions for their use. Is this what you expect from honest, ethical city workers? I Is this why you gave them your email address?

Kirk   |September.17.2008 Collette Thank you for sharing your thoughts and that letter. That was beautiful! Here is another letter for the hollow- cranium-crew: http://www.apbweb.com/letters-to-the-editor-frompages-menu-32/915-september-letters-to-apb

Kirk   |September.17.2008 Here is a September letter that Steve Gordon sent to an online magazine, "American Police Beat": http://www.apbweb.com/letters-to-the-editor-frompages-menu-32/915-september-letters-to-apb -In Unity, Steve Gordon, President Vallejo Police Officers Assoc Also a good article at the bottom of the page: Man Up People!

Little Old Lady   |September.17.2008 Portland is a great model! There is an historic fountain near the waterfront with an inscription that reads "the wealth of a city is in its citizens" or something to that effect. The City of Portland funds staff for neighborhood councils made up of a group of similar and adjacent neighborhoods. NOTHING gets to the City Council without the blessing of the affected neighborhood council. Portland also has an aggressive Code Enforcement program. When I was there last, I saw a red-tag on a pretty Craftsman in the neighborhood where my ancestors once farmed. (For those that don't know, a red tag means that the City's Building Official had determined that the building cannot be occupied)I called and the City sent me the long list of Code violations....missing window putty, peeling paint, a cracked window, dryrot in the porch and a collapsing separate garage (now demolished). Gosh, if Vallejo did that, there would not be a building in the old town that wasn't red-tagged. Of course, this is why people in Portland keep their buildings well maintained. The Land Trust model is great but it does not deal with another major problem that Vallejo has...the lack of middle income families living and spending in the downtown. However politically incorrect that might be you need a certain level of income to be a homeowner and keep your home maintained. Vallejo's problems are systemic and we can't just cherry pick individual components out of other cities' economic strategies. I know that the Feds send pots of money for "affordable" (subsidized) housing to Vallejo and Vallejo city staff needs to spend that to get their cut. But what Vallejo really needs is more middle and upper income families in what are now predominately rental neighborhoods to create a demographic that supports retail and provides educated employees for sustainable, good businesses. (It makes no sense to have a world class ferry system and then pack the walkable area around that with subsidized housing for people who will never use it then build a parking garage on prime waterfront land for those that do) The Land Trust model still focusses on the poor. Another model is used by a group of cities...mostly on the other side of the Rockies...historic preservation. Cities using this model buy up rundown historic buildings in historic neighborhoods where they are trying to induce revitalization and then sell them for near nothing to middle income people who are willing to fix them up using the Secretary of the Interior's Standards for Rehabilitation and live in them for a period of maybe 3 to 5 years. Check out www.presnc.org for info on how that is used including special state tax credits. Oh, also note that North Carolina is one of the only states where property values are not collapsing. Vallejo's problem is a complete lack of political will...not the lack of effective and positive models out there. Can you imagine what the inscription on a fountain on our waterfront would have to read??? "The wealth of our City belongs to the greedy who don't live here"

Firebug   |September.17.2008 Thanks Robert, that pretty much sums up the city's priorities and we aren't in the top running. I hope that we can convince folks that this priority will never change until we elect council's not funded by PSU's, elect a Mayor that is a leader, and continue to work to remove BA from the City Charter.

Robert Schussel   |September.17.2008 I left one deal out For 2008 if a FF renews their Paramedic Certification they get $875 PLUS 48 hours of overtime pay.Previously it was $500 and 24 hours of OT. It should be noted that only FFs are require to maintain their Paramedic Certification. For all other ranks the Certification is not required. Anyone with a Certificate receives a 10% increase in their base wages.

Robert Schussel   |September.17.2008 One of the most depressing things that I saw at City Council was last nights discussion about the best way to protect $3,100 that was part of a seniors meal program (entire budget $47K). While deliberating about the $3K I kept thinking about some of the obscene deals the PSU has extracted that would would have funded Meals on Wheels and all of the other Social Programs 1) FFs are paid at the OT rate for all of their paid holidays even though the odds of working a holiday is 33%. 2) At least 11 FFs receive educational incentives ( not sure about PD) for Majors that have nothing to do with their job--estimated cost $75K to $100K per year. 3)Retroactive health insurance and 3@50 for PSU retirees. 4)3@50 vs 2.7@55 costs the City an extra 1.2 to 1.4 million a year. 5) FFs earn 5.2 weeks paid vacation after 13 years. Most other employees (with the exception of Exempt)need to have 21/26 years of service to reach that level. n

John K   |September.17.2008 Nice link, MISSMARVELOUS. Thank you Diana Lang, Carol Hardy, and Jennifer Wilson for a wonderful presentation last night on using a Community Land Trust for affordable home ownership in Vallejo. Not only will such a program provide affordable housing for citizens, it also appears to be affordable to the City, and will "recycle" houses and improve neighborhoods. An added bonus is spreading affordable housing throughout the City, rather than concentrating it into high density rental facilities such as Sereno Village and Marina Vista. Viva Vallejo!

MISSMARVELOUS   |September.17.2008 I am so excited about the possiblities of Vallejo adopting the "Community Land Trust." The city of Portland, Oregon has had this program in place since 1999 and has had a lot of success. It has helped rid areas of blight. If you have ever visited Portland, take a look at the Peral District, which once was a run down area, and now is home to a thriving community, shops and eateries. You can look at Portlands website at www.pclt.org to see how the program is run. It would be a better use of Housing funds!!! Little Old Lady do you know anything about this program? I bet you do, let the VIB readers know more about this program, pro's and cons...

Big City   |September.16.2008 The PSU officials have recently posted here lamenting the understaffing that currently exists in Vallejo. I know how to get the city public safety departments up to adequate staffing levels. Simply cut wages and benefits DRASTICALLY. That will free up enough money so that the citizens of Vallejo will have the staffing levels they need and deserve. The whole problem is that the PER UNIT cost of public safety has gotten so high, the city can't afford the staffing levels that the public safety unions say we need. So, if the city so desperately needs these staffing levels and the public safety unions are so concerned about the safety of the citizens of Vallejo, how come they haven't made the suggestion I just did? That would easily solve the staffing level problem and it's quite obvious.

silasbarnabe   |September.16.2008 Fact check? How about a reality check even, they haven't even removed "City employees fight City in Federal Bankruptcy Court" headline yet. I think it's official these people are just plain delusional, Ozzie and the funded four will indeed vote to put taxes on the ballot, and raise fees anyway they can with reckless abandon. It is also clear that they have so much confidence of their funded popularity that even if BA is removed from the charter they will add to their MOU's in an attempt to by-pass voters. Only thing now is if they attempt this we can now attach a recall effort to the BA removal campaign, this would be for Wilson and Hannigan off course. I can hardly wait!

On Fire   |September.16.2008 Fact Check time! Their statement: "Having closed two fire stations and eliminated more than 40 firefighters, response times are increasing at an alarming rate. Similar to police understaffing, Vallejo'sown study confirmed that it currently has 20% fewer firefighters that that recommended under minumum national safety standards". So just how much has the response time increased? Have they not learned that this type of propaganda (Rose Report) is what got them into trouble in the first place? Smoke and mirrors with ads that state the obvious? So now they are sitting back, thinking that they don't have to do anything but wait for the city to tell them what to do next? Really? Then do we really need to wait till Dec.? The city can makes it's recommendations and save a lot of time and money.

On Fire   |September.16.2008 So what exactly does this mean? The unions are saying that they have done their part? Is someone sippin' the blue kool-aid? If that were the case, why would the judge send them back to the table to talk about their "contracts"? It's clear that they are not ready to negotiate in good faith and they are still sticking to that fantasy ideology that the cuts are going to come from somewhere else. Notice though how both VPOA and IAFF have made the determination that they can't take anymore losses in employees. Guess that leaves IBEW to take the rest of the hits as they have mentioned nothing about them being vital or understaffed.

Little Red Riding Hood   |September.16.2008 Watch out for the wolf...trolling on the blogs. "As city employees, we have done what we can to put Vallejo back on track" Like wasting precious time with your bogus Rose Report? What inquiring Vallejoans want to know is, when will the PSUs come to the table in good faith?

J.M.   |September.16.2008 We interupt your normal blogs to bring you this...please go the link below..you will find it very interesting. I just want to be clear, even with all the turmoil at the present time with the safety unions, I do want to relate...Vallejo Ca. POLICE OFFICERS & FIREFIGHTERS PERFORM PHENOMENAL. Just drive in our City Streets at late/dawn hours and P.D is there keeping a watchful eye! Just want to be real!! Coalition against uneccessarry bankruptcy sends this... "Now that the City Council has proven that it's bankrupt, the question on everyone's mind is, what is the Council's plan to get us out of debt, restore vital services, and stop the exodus of public safety staff? Public safety employees have taken a 13% pay cut which has left Vallejo with barely enough police officers and firefighters to keep you safe. In fact, the FBI recommends 50% more police officers on the street and Vallejo's own study confirmed that it currently has 20% fewer firefighters than that recommended under minimum national safety standards. As city employees, we have done what we can to put Vallejo back on track. Now, like you, we await the Council's comprehensive plan to revitalize our local economy, and restore public safety services that taxpayers need and deserve. " Steve Gordon President, Vallejo Police Officers Association Kurt Henke President, Firefighters Local 1186 Frank Caballero President, IBEW Local 2376 http://www.vallejobankruptcyupdate.com/

Former Union Supporter   |September.16.2008 A union bankrupts a city and they reward themselves? That just shows that the labor movement is dead as a movement of working people. They are obviously out of touch, greedy, corrupt, bullying, and no longer relevant.

Bottomless pit of disgust   |September.16.2008 Riley has no shame and this article/award illustates his complete disregard for reality and the city's situation. A quote from the CDF web site: "Even as it faces one of the most aggressive management attacks in the history of collective bargaining" HA Riley's and the CDF's hypocrisy is alive and well.

Holy Cow   |September.16.2008 These morons got an award? Vallejo FFs Local 1186 Wins Statewide Labor Fed Organizing Award http://www.cpf.org/go/cpf/news-and-events/news/vallejo-ffs-wins-statewide-labor-fed-organizing-award/ Even as it faces one of the most aggressive management attacks in the history of collective bargaining, Vallejo Firefighters Local 1186 has been able to count on a united and active Napa/Solano Central Labor Council. This week, Local 1186 was recognized for its part in creating that steadfast labor unity. At its annual awards dinner in Oakland this week, the California Labor Federation presented Local 1186 with its award for Outstanding Volunteer Mobilization. The award is culmination of an effort that has been a long time in the making. Six years ago, Vallejo Firefighters Local 1186 was involved in a local election campaign against an anti-labor candidate. Sadly, when the Local

listenandbeheard   |September.16.2008 thanks for this site! i like to be able to come here and see what my neighbors are thinking. a question/comment. i think ibvallejo needs to have a tv show on vcat... you will soon see l&bh there doing its thing for the arts. i'm kinda tired of the fourth of july parade. it is september. so come on guys and girls...i'd like to see you do your part too, providing local tv programming. maybe you're all ugly and prefer hiding behind words on paper? well, maybe a talk radio show then at blogtalkradio.com/ibvallejo....? there's more than one way to get people talking! actually there's more than two too. wishing you Peace and Poetry ps please listen in tonight 8-9pm if you're interested in hearing poetry, or sharing some of yours. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/listenandbeheard/2008/09/17/Listen-Be-Heard-Poetry-Open-Mic

On Fire   |September.15.2008 Born in Vallejo, it sounds like you would prefer to continue arguement over discourse? The hand has been offered, you can choose to take it and start working toward the betterment of Vallejo, or continue the arguements. The unions have had their weapons of choice displayed and have yet to stand down. They still are threatening further legal appeals and further fighting to further drag this situation out. Why are you not calling for their "olive branch"? Ms. Gomes listened to the union's offers, as did the rest of Council. Are you saying she should have remained silent and that the taxpayers are not suppose to hear the truth? It has been reviewed and decided by the judge that the so called offers from the unions would not have helped even during the current year. This was the same "truth" that Ms. Gomes commented on. Yet even after this has been proven through the courts, the union persist on continuing the fight through more fabrications. They have never extended a olive branch that didn't have thorns, or a true hand that didn't covered a hidden sword. They had ample opportunity to make peace within the entire community, yet they chose to continue to lie to us. Have you taken them to task for their part of this fisaco? The anger has been narrowly directed at Ms. Gomes because she spoke out and made decisions on what she thought was good for the city. It wasn't as if she didn't know what she was talking about. This has now been shown by the court's decision. The attacks against Gomes started long before the city had started moving toward bankruptcy. This started long before the last election. That's a long time to have non-stop hate directed your way. Yet she still offers her hand. So the choice is clear, take it and see if there is change wiht both sides working together. Or, keep your fists clenched and wait on the judge to decide your fate.

Shocked   |September.15.2008 I am shocked by Born in Vallejo's tone and message. You would almost be not worth responding to except I think you need a good dose of reality. The UNIONS failed to negotiate in good faith. The UNIONS abused the system by LYING about "hidden monies". The UNIONS were the ones to take this crap to court, wracking up HUGE legal fees for the TAXPAYERS of Vallejo. The UNIONS prolonged this in a cynical attempt to pressure the city to fold. The UNIONS lost. Period. Now, the unions can come to the table and negotiate fairly or the unions can get their asses kicked again by Judge McManus and have their contracts stripped, their membership left without jobs while the city can bring in outside agencies to fill those jobs. There was no need for Gomes to write what she did other than to encourage ALL of us to open up, learn from the past and move into a better future. Your cynicism, Born in Vallejo, is an excellent example of not moving forward. Get over it, Gomes is smarter than you give her credit for, more interested in moving this city forward than you and actually has the interests of the taxpayers at heart instead of the self-interest-only union wannabe bullies. As someone else said, you are either on the buss, moving the city forward or you are in the way. Move it, loser.

Also Born in Vallejo   |September.15.2008 For whatever reason or motive a hand is extended, it's still an extended hand isn't it? Why couldn't the unions come to the table with true intentions and an extended hand months ago?? Or was that them shaking one hand while holding the "Rose Report" in the other?

captain   |September.15.2008 Has there been any commentary from Public Works or VFD regarding the "bad grid" (i.e. low water pressure) during the Casa-Fire?

Anonymous   |September.15.2008 no word from Gomes re Casa fire,dead,lack of alarms

Born in Vallejo   |September.15.2008 Well, Ms. Gomes, it's about time. Why wasn't this letter written months ago when it was needed to possibly quell the separation between Employer and Employee. I read sincerity in your letter, but I don't have the warm fuzzy feeling that this letter intended to create. I, instead, have apprehension that this letter serves a greater set of processes for you. You believe it makes you look "bigger" than the other side by extending your hand, this in turn, makes you look like a wonderful council woman. However, you would be a wonderful politician if you had penned this letter and its sentiments months ago. It was a chance for you to have the limelight, once again, turned on you since the television media has basically grown tired of Vallejo and its mess. If you truly wanted to extend a hand, you would have been able to do it by simply sending a letter to the Union negotiators, and then letting them respond to you, without advertising the fact you now wish to play nice. I realize that your constituents have the right to know what is going on, but there is a time and place, and protocol, and apparently you have no idea when or what those are. Like the consummate politician with further aspirations, you placed this letter AFTER the bankruptcy was validated, and you feel the Unions don't have the power they had before the validation. How political. Kick the guard dog, and when he's down, try and pet him and make nice. If he growls, he's the bad dog. I sincerely hope the Unions accept the idea of the open hand, as backhanded as your offer is, they just need to make sure that while shaking the one hand, other one isn't holding a weapon.

On Fire   |September.15.2008 A big shout out to John and Maureen! They were seen out early this morning painting out graffiti on the Springs Road overpass! Thank you and we appreciate your work in the community. You two are part of why Vallejo is a great! Viva Vallejo!

captain   |September.15.2008 Cease-Fire in vallejo? An excellent two page article from "The Bond Buyer" Mustard estimates Vallejo & unions have each spent just over a million dollars on BK legal fees. He also discusses a framework for collective bargaing that may allow both sides to come together -- and other issues that will likely drive a wedge through the heart of the negotiations. http://bondbuyer.com/article?id=20080911254TFZ5Z

captain   |September.15.2008 Cease-Fire in Vallejo? An excellent two page article from

Truth Teller   |September.14.2008 Marc, thank you so much for writing this compelling and horrible account of the Casa D disaster. There are so many stories to come out of this tragedy and only you have chosen to follow up and give them voice. Shame on that rag the Slimes Horrid for being mute. I can only hope that there are several investigations by outside authorities and the responsible parties not only pay the penalties, but learn from these mistakes so that no one else will lose their life because of their negligence.

Ann O Nemus   |September.14.2008 This Palin phenom is so polarizing, it caused the T-H to shut down many comment threads. When will this "bubble" burst?

HoLyCoW   |September.12.2008 After listening to just a snippet of Palin's interview, I became more concerned then before. Forget about putting lipstick on a pig, if you put a veil on her she sounds like the extremist woman calling for jihad. She stated that this is God's war? We should attack anyone who is perceived to be a threat? OMG! An intersting blogsite was started by some women in California called: womanagainstsarahpalin.blogspot.com . It started with just a few friends and has grown to over 100,000 comments from all over the U.S. There are interesting thoughts and we should be adding to the masses.

Firebug   |September.12.2008 Onfire, Just like has been said before this Mayor is not a leader, but a follower. If he can't show leadership for the former Casa De Vallejo residents there is no way he is capable of showing leadership for the rest of us.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.12.2008 Thank you John and Maureen for the report - you have highlighted the situation as it is: take away all the rhetoric, bullying, postering and what is left? A city with no more $ Contracts that are not affordable All sides that need to give up something

On Fire   |September.12.2008 I understand that the Casa people have been given a reprieve from the possibility of being homeless as of yesterday. The Logan group has extended their payments for housing until Monday. At which time the County is trying to come in and assist them in finding housing. It's still a travesty that these seniors are in this type of predicament and that we have a mayor that chooses to keep his head in the sand about the reality these seniors are facing.

Firebug   |September.12.2008 I am looking forward to how they "spin" the tax to enahnce the general fund, of all the whoppers that have come out of the Union and City hall these should be priceless!

Fed UP   |September.12.2008 First rate Opinion article in the TH by George Will with the Washington Post today. I am looking forward to Jon Riley's "Get the Facts," Rebuttal.

Yeah Right   |September.11.2008 Even if and when we get PSU wages to where they should be, we still won't be able to afford more officers as we need the money to pay for, I dunno, street maintenance comes to mind, for one. 1 officer per 1000 is pretty typical. Unless you want to pay even more in taxes which are already higher than neighboring cities... You can pay my share

Joanie   |September.11.2008 Yawn...Mr. C must not know the judge ruled that Vallejo is BK. Bankrupt. Insolvent. Broke. It doesn't matter what the FBI suggests. Unless they're going to give us money to hire more cops. Which I doubt. But hey, I have a novel idea. Pay our cops a more reasonable wage, which would still be a great salary, and be able to afford to hire more cops. Wow! Why didn't we think of that earlier?

Juliana   |September.11.2008 Mark was not lying, I witnessed it first hand. Logan Properties Told Me to My face that the senior that I was with could not use the section 8 Voucher until they signed Logan's waiver. She said and may I quote..."it is double dipping" and that they would not receive their deposits back until they signed the waiver. I was there, I saw too Osby!

Tom Bosley   |September.11.2008 Waz up wid dat: You mean you do not know the population of the City of Vallejo? Your home?..Well to round it off, OUR population is 120,000 citizens, not counting the unincorporated area, which for your information, are not part of OUR City. Now per your message, the FBI recommends 2 officers per 1000 citizens. When I want to school in Vallejo, the math would show me we SHOULD have 240 sworn Vallejo Police Officers, WE have, as of last week, approximatly 130 sworn members of the VPD or as they are kindly referred to, members of the PSU. Now since you think so much of Sacramento, how many more would you like the City to cut or get to quit???? Or are you just another PSU Troll?????

IhaVeNeVErtRuSTeD   |September.11.2008 the FBI.

Waz up wid dat?   |September.11.2008 Last night there was a news story from the Sacramento local station that due to the fact the public safety workers are 70% of the City of Sacramento's general fund, they will be cutting police officers jobs, actually they will not be filling the postions of early retiring officers. Per the news reporter, they have about 700 sworn officers, and the FBI recommends 2 officers per 1000 persons. Disregarding our unincorporated areas which are served by the sheriff department, does any one know how many officers we should have in Vallejo based on the FBI recommendations? I am not for sure what the population is in our unincorporated areas....

Firebug   |September.11.2008 Silas and Sonic, I have never trusted Ozzie and the funded four and of course now Ron Rhea trying to "make nice". They obviously are wanting a tax, but the truth is it only takes 34 percent of the voters to nix that. Like it or not they are still on the hook in the general fund not only for public safety, but roads and infrastructure and everything else that it takes to run a city.

Sonic Toad   |September.11.2008 I don't trust the majority of the council to make a sustainable deal. After all of this testimony and the decision by the judge I fear that most of them STILL do not understand this issue. My preference is to keep the plan going until December and let the judge make the ruling. Before then I'm sure that the Union leaders will continue as always and negotiate within the bounds of the existing contracts as Mustard already stated. Let the contracts be voided and let them have zero question. Will they get it then....doubtful.

silasbarnabe   |September.11.2008 Thanks to John and Maureen for an excellent sober account of the next few months. I think most of us knew the only powers PSU's have left is BA and to maintain their control over elected officials hence the general fund. Thanks to the reality of BK we now also have a couple of very strong tools. With Ozzie and the funded four most of knew a contract extension would be imminent, but remember when it comes to new revenue WE control the purse strings. As long as there is BA and a funded majority council we must never vote a tax to enhance the monetary power of a PSU slanted council. Remember if you are injured or your vehicle is damaged because of lack of maintained streets put in a claim. You are owed just as employees are permitted to put in claims if their contracts are voided so are you if you are injured! If we do not demand the council look after our interests using what is afforded to us in the courts they never will. Don't forget if you feel you see collusion or graft with our elected officials put a claim in with the FBI http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/pubcorrupt/pubcorrupt.htm We can also continue to report issues like the UBL scandal to the press and grand jury. Let's keep the pressure eon our elected officials to serve its citizens!

logan/amerland/ l.a. slum land   |September.10.2008 http://www.lafla.org/news/viewNews.asp?id=371

Anonymous   |September.10.2008 http://cangress.wordpress.com/2008/08/27/fire-in-vallejo-logan-property-management-building-2-dead/

YOUMean   |September.10.2008 that the lack of sprinklers that was "grandfathered" in allowed this building that housed seniors, many of whom have mobility problems, become a "fire trap"? And, youbetchabygollyDAN, someone needs to look into whether these seniors were coerced to sign documents giving up their rights. We want the truth.

Anonymous   |September.10.2008 sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a... LA CAN Los Angeles Community Action Network� LAPD Runs Amuck

property managers, not!   |September.10.2008 sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a... LA CAN Los Angeles Community Action Network� LAPD Runs Amuck

Anonymous   |September.10.2008 I don't know - if I were an infirm person living in senior housing, for which the landlords are getting federal market rate subsidies, I would not be happy with the answer that someone smoking near an oxygen tank creating a fire is not the propery owners liability. What I heard is that the smoker's cigarette caught on fire, no alarm or sprinkler went off, and the fire spread to another room with oxygen. Its all speculation -- but this needs a complete investigation, and I'd like it to be done by a third & neutral party.

Dan Healy   |September.10.2008 I have already been in discussions with legal aid about the Casa de issues and assisting people with possible claims. Its a little more complicated than some might think, and it looks like there is conflicting stories about some of the issues. If indeed the Casa was negligent in its maintenance of the property or of fire warning systems, there will probably be some valid claims by residents. Certainly all residents should refrain from signing any releases presented to them by Casa - I am told that many people were told they had to sign a blanket waiver of claims against Casa before they could get Section 8 vouchers. That would clearly be a mistake, and may give rise to elder abuse claims against Casa if Casa tries to enforce such waivers. On the other hand, if the Casa was up to code (or lawfully grandfathered) and the fire started because someone was smoking near an oxygen tank (as I am told some suspect), then there might not be much of a claim for tenants to assert against the Casa owners. One lesson to be learned is that it is often a good idea for tenants to have their own property insurance.

Firebug   |September.10.2008 Onfire Still same old Times Horrid, they are trying to work with the PSU's to negotiate the majority of the general fund for their salaries and leave roads non-profits and others things that folks might want to vote on a tax.

On Fire   |September.10.2008 Osby's Neighbor, I don't think I was harsh. Watching his body language and hearing his tone really was irritating. If the seniors that were involved were listening, I can imagine how they may have felt being called a liar. If the intent of the property management company wasn't to make the seniors feel intimidated by signing the forms, they did a poor job conveying it. Granted, some may have mistook what the people stated, which is questionable still, but if that's the case, shouldn't someone feel obligated to assure the seniors that that wasn't the case instead of simply denying that it happen? I just don't think it was appropriate of the Mayor to simply dismiss the concerns of these citizens. They are under a tremendous amount of stress and a little more compassion and patience is warrented. On another note, can someone pinch me! Did someone take over the times-horrid that actually has a brain? It took the ruling of a judge to have them realize that Tanner and Council were telling the truth? Okay, has the times horrid staff been taken over by subversive hatters?

WHeReSISDAn   |September.10.2008 Healy when someone actually needs him. Perhaps Dan might want to look into these seniors legal rights, pro bono? There is no way that any commercial residence housing seniors would escape at least annual inspections by the FD. If it has happened the city should be held liable. Accordingly, the insurance carriers for the Casa De Vallejo would have made it mandatory for the sprinklers to be installed, working, inspected etceteRA. That includes working water inlets, fire extingquishers and inspections ETCETERA. You can believe that the city is squirming and scrambling right now.

Little Old Lady   |September.10.2008 There are approximately 2,000 Housing Choice Vouchers and 2,000 Project Based Vouchers used in Vallejo. All Housing Choice Voucher properties are supposed to be inspected yearly by the VHA, who administers that program. The smoke detectors are just one item on the long check list. So there should be inspection reports in VHA's file for every one of those properties recieving Section 8 vouchers for each year. That's what VHA's 20% administration fee ($5.4 million) is for. The Project Based Vouchers for the Casa and others are done directly by HUD in SF and there should be one for every year also. It is unclear why, when meals etc. were part of the deal at the Casa, it is not an Assisted Living facility with a license from the State. The State is very serious and requires, for example, two means of egress from upper floors one of which must be a ramp if mobility impaired people are living above the ground floor. For group homes including those for under 6 kids, halfway houses and other facilities that need licenses from the California Department of Social Services, the state inspectors often rely on the local fire department. The Community Care Licensing Department takes all complaints very seriously. Their website is www.ccld.cc.gov. All of these facilities are subsidized by the Feds and it adds up to a very big money machine.

No break for Ozzie!   |September.10.2008 I don't think Osby deserves a break! Marc was simply presenting information from his interviews, and Ozzie, yet again stepped over his boundaries by arguing with Marc during Community Forum. It was only when Marc wanted to respond that Ozzie said the discussion was out of line!!! Just watch the video of the council meeting! What Ozzie implied very strongly was that the seniors (or Marc?) were lying. This is very serious and both seniors, firefighters, police and anyone else involved in that fire were put in harms way. Whether or not the property managers are now going to correct the sprinkler/alarm issue, they need to reimburse the seniors (and sadly for the next of kin) for the dispution to their lives (and loss of life) and to the city for the extra cost of fighting an out-of-control fire that might have done much less damage had there been smoke alarms and sprinklers. Ozzie needs to not show his bias for the property management.

VHS   |September.10.2008 Little Old lady, do you know if there are differences in the regulations between the project based vouchers and the choice vouchers? Can you imagine the time and cost involved if a question is raised about inspections on all the choice voucher properties? I think we learned there were over 2000 choice voucher units in Vallejo currently.

Little Old Lady   |September.10.2008 According to all the copious HUD standards, guidelines and bureaucratic gobblygook, inspections of housing units receiving HUD Section 8 vouchers must be inspected, at a minimum, annually. HUD's checklist includes the following: ____ A working smoke detector with a live battery must be installed on every level of the unit, including the basement and outside of sleeping rooms. If any family member has hearing loss, a smoke detector for the hearing impaired must be installed.

Osbys Neighbor   |September.10.2008 On Fire This is a first for me--defending the Mayor. I think you were being a little harsh on him. To his credit he heard a rumor about seniors having to sign a release before getting a voucher and tried to get the specfics.He also saw Marc Garmins interviews. My question is that if the Management Company lied to him how could he have verified this if he didn't hear the conversations. Yes,the issue of non functioning sprinklers and alarms was side stepped . I hope that others in addition to Marc press the City to update the ordances so that all residences MUST have Smoke Detectors and that during renovation sprinklers must be installed in hotels,half way homes etc.

Vallejo Heights   |September.09.2008 Oops -- guess not. Anyway, Google "Anne Kilkenny" and you'll find it easily enough. It's being reprinted on blogs all over the place.

Vallejo Heights   |September.09.2008 I am a resident of Wasilla, Alaska. I have known Sarah since 1992. Everyone here knows Sarah, so it is nothing special to say we are on a first-name basis. Our children have attended the same schools. Her father was my child

Vallejo Heights   |September.09.2008 OF, the original letter RdP is trying to copy is by a woman named Anne Kilkenny who lives in Wasilla. Google her name and you'll find it. (I'll also try cutting and pasting -- I think I know a way to make it work. We shall see in a moment.)

On Fire   |September.09.2008 I have to say that I was surprised at Ozzy's response to the waiver issue. He carefuly side stepped the sprinklers and fire alarm issues though. But his tone and posturing was odd and almost as if he was the legal council for the property management company. For someone on Council to say that everything is just peachy and moving along so smoothly, then almost angrily denying what the seniors were saying is such bad PR. So was Ozzy saying that the seniors were lying? He didn't sit in on a single interview that we know of yet he can state with authority that he knows that no seniors were told that they would not receive their belongings or deposit if they didn't sign the waiver? Even if there is a possibility that the seniors were mistaken about what they heard, Ozzy didn't seem interested in making sure the confusion was corrected or their concerns were alleviated. His tone revealed irritation that the issue was even being brought before Council. I guess this information was only for his attention and that it wasn't necessary for the rest of Council to be informed? But then again, these are the type of people he has made his living from. Evicting seniors and poor people. I remember hearing that same dismissive tone before, when he was speaking about poor folks. So much for showing compassion for nearly the 75% of the people who are facing homlessness in a few days. Guess it's not his problem. If all of these seperate agencies are involved, why are there so many seniors still confused and anxious about their situation? Certainly there is a disconnect in communications and an apparent disinterest in what the Casa people are going through by Ozzy. I imagine that all of the seniors are going through an extremely stressful period and it has to be affecting their health. I don't know if I am more embarrased by his display of irritation for having this brought up, or angry that he is our Mayor and supposed to be representing the City.

On Fire   |September.09.2008 RDP, you miht try sending the article to Marc via email and maybe he can post it for you. I'm anxious to here the rest.

RdP   |September.09.2008 Sarah and her whole family are avid hunters. She's smart. Her experience is as mayor of a city with a population of about 5,000 (at the time) and less than 2 years as governor of a state with about 670,000 residents. During her mayoral administration most of the actual work of running this small city was turned over to an administrator. She had been pushed to hire this administrator by party power-brokers after she had gotten herself into some trouble over precipitous firings which had given rise to a recall campaign. Sarah campaigned in Wasilla as a "fiscal conservative". During her 6 years as Mayor, she increased general government expenditures by over 33%. During those same 6 years the amount of taxes collected by the City increased by 38%. This was during a period of low inflation (1996-2000). She reduced progressive property taxes and increased a regressive sales tax which taxed even food. The tax cuts that she promoted benefited large corporate property owners way more than they benefited residents. The huge increases in tax revenues during her mayoral administration weren't enough to fund everything on her wish list though, borrowed money was needed too. She inherited a city with zero debt, but left it with indebtedness of over $22 million. What did Mayor Palin encourage the voters to borrow money for? Was it the infrastructure that she said she supported? The sewage treatment plant that the city lacked? Or a new library? No. $1M for a park, $15M plus for construction of a multi-use sports complex which she rushed through to build on a piece of property that the City didn't even have clear title to, that was still in litigation 7 years later - to the delight of the lawyers involved! The sports complex itself was a nice addition to the community but a huge money pit, not the profit-generator she claimed it would be. She also supported bonds for $5.5M for road projects that could have been done in 5-7 years without any borrowing. (...to be continued)

RdP   |September.09.2008 Sorry, cut & paste doesn't work. I'll type it out: ...in every way she's like the most popular girl in middle school. Even men who think she is a poor choice and won't vote for her can't quit smiling when talking about her because she is a "babe". It is astonishing and almost scary how well she can keep a secret. She kept her most recent pregnancy a secret from her children and parents for 7 months. She is "pro-life". She recently gave birth to a Down's syndrome baby. There is no cover-up involved here: Trig is her baby. She is energetic and hardworking. She regularly worked out at the guy. She is savvy. She doesn't take positions; she just "puts things out there" and if they prove to be popular, then she takes credit. Her husband works a union job on the North Slope for BP and is a champion snowmobile racer. Todd Palin's kind of job is highly sought-after because of the schedule and high pay. He arranges his work schedule so he can fish for salmon in Bristol Bay for a month or so in summer, but by no stretch of the imatination is fishing their major source of income. Nor has her life style ever been anything like that of native Alaskans.

RdP   |September.09.2008 (pretty lengthy - I'll try to get it in piecemeal): she

RdP   |September.09.2008 Also...this is from a woman who lives in Wasilla and has attended lots of Palin's meetings while she was mayor: I am a resident of Wasilla, Alaska. I have known Sarah since 1992. Everyone here knows Sarah, so it is nothing special to say we are on a first-name basis. Our children have attended the same schools. Her father was my child's favorite substitute teacher. I also am on a first name basis with her parents and mother-in-law. I attended more City Council meetings during her administration than about 99% of the residents of the city. She is enormously popular; in every way she

RdP   |September.09.2008 I'll bet the hearing on the contracts was stretched out to December because the Judge intends for the unions & the City to reach an agreement. That being said...I've no doubt that the unions know they've got NO bargaining powers. If you read his 52 page decision, the Judge makes it obvious that the writing is on the wall re. those contacts. So...I think the City is all over this and if the unions are smart, they'll reach an agreement. The City gave them so much and yet they still rejected previous offers...it won't happen again (at least, I hope not).

Vallejo Heights   |September.09.2008 Thanks Silas and Firebug for the replies. I think my anxiety over the situation came from forgetting the presence of some important people in the situation, most notably Judge McManus, but also the heroic city staff (Mayer, Whittom, Stout, and of course Tanner). It will be interesting to see if any progress can be made in the new negotiations. On the surface, the PSUs aren't changing their tune at all, but I think they will be very motivated to settle without having the contracts voided. If the judge does void the contracts, cities all across the nation will start eying bankruptcy as a certain path to liberation from oppressive contracts. The unions won't want that precedence set.

GangaJim   |September.09.2008 Gary, oh Gary, where for art thou, Gary?

Enough!   |September.09.2008 (Sorry Barack) After reading the arrogant statement of Mat Mustard today, I'm feeling like we need a little more scorched earth to bring home the fact that it's not going to be another round or five of wankfest "negotiations". What needs to happen is that they everyone realizes will be deficit spending shortly - AND WE DON'T HAVE THE MONEY! The judge needs to rule that the contracts are now voided and the unions must start from ground zero (pun intended). I, and I know many others, will not stand for the countless hours of false negotiations. That's OUR money you are wasting and WE expect you to tighten up and offer up a reasonable - to both parties - agreement right quick. A word of warning to the unions - you delay, posture and hem and haw, you will see the court of public sentiment (what was left in your favor) solidly against you.

REgaRDlESS   |September.09.2008 of who was responsible for bringing the building up to code, the onus is up to the city to make sure the building is safe for its residents and, if not, cite it and shut it down until it is. Three people have died and over a hundred are homeless and if this does not get people off their butts to hold people accountable, then nothing will.

said it out loud   |September.09.2008 Mr. Tanner, It would be very nice if you would sit in on the negotiations, since they are part of the job that you are receiving a very large paycheck for, from a very bankrupt City.

Firebug   |September.09.2008 VH, If you read the Times Horrid today you will see Mat Mustard's assertian that he will only negotiate within the framework of the current contract. "any other negotiations would be a waste of time". November election or not we have at last negotiation power to make the unions come back to the table. The Judge already ruled that the GF cannot afford these contracts. I also don't expect as much hanky panky like Ozzie and the funded four's sweeping the UBL under the table as everyone is watching here. The BK Judge, the FBI that are already in the bay area investigating the dubious activities of Don Perata, and Oakland City Manager Edgersly. The funded four and Ozzie need money to "make deals" and with the cupboard empty and the Judge agreeing that other funds cannot be legally raided to enhance the general fund there isn't a lot of reason's I can think of to giveup our advantages.

Tax payer   |September.09.2008 Mr. Tanner, I respectfully ask that you personally sit in the negotiations and lead the management team. The tax payers of Vallejo are counting on your experience and skills to strike the best deal possible for those of us that pay for services. Thank you and good luck.

silasbarnabe   |September.09.2008 I can hardly wait for the inspection report, who knew and when did they know it. Vallejo Heights- With the court accepting the City's BK petition the time is now to aggressively negotiate a new contract that leaves some budgets for roads, some funding to our non-profits (like the Senior Center). For the first time since 1975 the City actually has a 500 pound gorilla in the room called BK. None of this requires an Olive Branch or friendly ties of any kind. If the Union doesn't come back to the table the likely result of the December 2 decision is the judge will rip up the contracts and our PSU frinds know it.

Little Old Lady   |September.08.2008 It appears that HUD was responsible for making sure that the Casa de Vallejo was safe and habitable through the Project Based Section 8 Vouchers negotiated directly with the property owner. And yes, they have copious standards for inspections. http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d02282.pdf But the Casa was owned by Hal Boax, once the Planning Director of the City of Vallejo with strong good old boy ties up until a couple of years ago. So a lot of issues might have been "overlooked". The guy at the HUD regional office in San Francisco who negotiated directly with Mr. Boax is Ernest Mollins. The VHA does not appear to be involved here. The State Department of Social Services often requests inspections by the local fire department. They look to make sure nobody with mobility impairments is living above the ground floor, there is a safe path of egress, windows provide legal egress and hardwired smoke detectors are working, etc. But it appears that Federal law trumps the California Building Code. There is one damming HUD report from 2002 at http://www.hud.gov/offices/oig/reports/files/ig291001.pdf Your questions should be addressed to Mr. Mollins in San Francisco. Also note the distribution list on the 2002 HUD report; perhaps someone on that list in Washington might care about the victims of this horrendous lapse in compassion. HUD should also be asked who inspects group homes for foster kids recieving Federal subsidies...like the two Mary's Help Homes that recently burned and FOIA all the inspection reports. It may be that it all loops back to the Vallejo Fire Department who has a stake in fomenting the "people will die" hysteria.

momster   |September.08.2008 It's a sad day when prisons have better living conditions then senior homes, and when prisoners have more rights and representation then our seniors. I say class action suit. Where's Mr. Cloutier, esquire?

On Fire   |September.08.2008 I initially wondered if maybe some of the seniors could have been disoriented and in shock so maybe they didn't realize that the sprinklers were going and the smoke alarms were ringing, but I have yet to hear one person say they saw or heard either when they were evacuating. There didn't appear to be anyone that was wet from running under the sprinklers. If there wasn't so many of the people saying the same thing, then it would be easier to question their recollection of the events. At one time during prior ownership, there were attendents at the front desk 24 hours a day. The residents had a bell system of some sort that they could pull to alert the desk in case of some emergancy. From what I hear, there is no one at the desk after certain hours and if you had an emergancy, you had to call the night person in their apartment. So if you have trouble getting to your phone to call out, you may be in trouble? I thought about their situation and so many questions came to mind. I hope that the fire inspector's report will touch on some of the concerns we are hearing. My smoke alarm goes off from bacon cooking, so how did the alarms in the rooms not go off? Especially on the fifth and sixth floor rooms? Now if they are like many of our relatives that use hearing aides, they take them off at night. So how do you then hear a smoke alarm? There seems to be a need for a better way to alert someone to an emergancy. I hope that this is not the case in the Marina Towers or any other senior complex. I think all the other senior residences are newer and have both sprinklers and smoke alarms in their rooms. But it just makes you wonder. And just what was the release that the residents were being forced to sign? I thought that Logan was "concerned" about the residents? What happened to the $15,000+ that was raised for the people a couple of weeks ago? Can't they use part of that to continue paying for a motel till they can find housing? I just can't put my head around the fact that most of these seniors will be homeless by weeks end. Our mayor says he is totally confident that Logan is doing everything they can but it doesn't jive with what we are hearing.

Vallejo Heights   |September.08.2008 Firebug, don't you think it's likely that the contracts will be resolved prior to next November's election? I agree that BA needs to go the way of the dinosaur but it may not be out of the way soon enough. In fact, I've just looked at the continuation document linked on the VIB home page and the motion to reject the contracts has been delayed to early December "at the request of parties." Surely this means negotiations are about to re-open?

Analmous   |September.08.2008 Llittle old Lady should tell you that Hotels, Motels, Condominium,TownHouses and Apartment buildings shall be protected with sprinkler systems designed and installed in accordance with NFPA 13, Standard for the Installation of Sprinkler Systems. But those slacker PSU firefighters tried to fool us with the NFPA BS regarding response times and staffing.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.08.2008 Kind of fishy...i went to youtube and can watch other VIB TV videos...hmmm.

MISSMARVELOUS   |September.08.2008 Little Old Lady, please help address the issues at hand regarding the Casa de Valljo. Can you tell the readers of VIB who is responsible for ensuring that fire sprinklers and fire alarms are in working order in a commerical building? This particular building received Federal Funding due to the fact it is low-income senior housing. How in the world was the lack of fire sprinklers and fire alarms overlooked? what about fire extinguishers, where they in working order? Will the Feds be notified that funding was given to a building in non-compliance? What about fire hydrants that have no pressure? Who can we write to, to make sure something like this never happens again?

missmarvelous   |September.08.2008 What no fire alarms and no fire sprinklers in a Federally sub'ed senior housing complex? In the commercial building where I work, the fire department comes un-announced every year to make sure our building is up to fire code. When was the last time this building was inspected? How could it pass a fire inspection with out working sprinkers and working fire alarms? When was the last time the fire department tested the pressure of the fire hydrants in the near and surrounding areas? What the heck is going on?

silasbarnabe   |September.08.2008 This could very well be Vallejo's own Katrina. When did authorities know when the "levees" or safety equipment was substandard? Who is obligated to certify a facility is safe and how often are these inspections required? One thing for sure as time goes on there will likely be more questions than answers, and having mostly followers in Vallejo's highest elected offices we will likely be turning to our proven minority leadership for solutions to try to help out our most dis-respected Vallejoan's in need.

Sonic Toad   |September.08.2008 Wow, what a disturbing video today about the Casa de. Over and over again the residents said that there was no alarm going off, and no sprinklers working. I can't possibly question what these people are saying when we hear it over and over again that nothing was working. So who has responsibility to audit this safety equipment plus the several references to hydrants with no water? This is really disturbing video and I congratulate Marc for digging out the truth that we would otherwise not know about.

NeedToVent   |September.08.2008 and wasn't this the same Chamber of Sabotage Commerce that ran out the Solano Mall proposal in Valllejo? I remember, because I was living here at the time.

NeedToVent   |September.08.2008 we agree with everything On Fire says in regards to Vallejo's Chamber of Cronies. During the La Pinata mural project, it was the Chamber of cronies that gave the muralist a bad time. Well, when the artist got through with that individual in which that particular person relized that, "hey they're not idiots I can push around, " that individual never came back. oh, and not to mention that particular person flashed a picture Mayor Davis to us (as if we care). On another note, the mural team was directed to thank everyone--hannigan, state farm, for something they pretty much had nothing to do with. And, when the muralist asked to be reimbursed for the paint; they said "we'll only give you half the money for the paint or we want it back. This is right after the muralist gave them another free mural on the waterfront. Vallejo needs to give credit to where it deserves.

Firebug   |September.08.2008 Onfire, "Tartuffe troll" I love it! The other strange thing is I have no idea why so many of these trolls want to believe that you, silas, sonic, others and myself are one and the same The writing styles from all of us are all over the spectrum, we would clearly have to be one person with half a dozen distinct personalities

On Fire   |September.08.2008 I agree Firebug, Bosley has expressed his glee when he thought that another poster had "put us in our place", yet he calls for an end to the "self-seving rhetoric" when we are speaking. Tom speaks out of both sides of his mouth. Tartuffe Troll.

Sonic Toad   |September.08.2008 "The mayor and entire council do deserve some credit for voting unanimously on BK. Yes, their backs were to the wall" This whole "giving credit" to the funded four and ozzie is way overblown. There was no choice (ie: your back against the wall statement). It's like you pick one of these two choices: 1) Jump off a cliff to reach the bottom 2) Back away from the cliff edge and find an easier and safer way to the bottom of the canyon. If they didn't vote for #2 we would truly have voted in mentally deranged people looking to commit suicide. Although I oppose 5 of the 7 I am sure none of the people on the dais have serious mental problems. So this vote to enter BK was not a big unanimous vote of unity and harmony. It was a unanimous vote to not jump off the cliff and see themselves and the city splattered all over while the scavengers feed on our remains. You know who the scavengers are right? Substitute the PSU Leaders for McCain in this photo as they feed on our splattered bodies after jumping off the cliff. http://tinyurl.com/5aewme

Firebug   |September.08.2008 Vallejo Heights I think you are being premature with your olive branch. As long as binding arbitration is in the charter there is no way I or anyone I know would even think of extending my hand to a shark that can't be trusted and still has teeth.

Firebug   |September.08.2008 Hey Tom left me out ! FOr the record Tom Ozzie, Ozzie, Ozzie there does that offend you? Silas is correct Gomes ,Shively, Pearsal, and Cloutier have proven they are leaders and the Courts support this. Ozzie has proven he is a follower and not a leader. A leader would have been on the same financial page as our true leaders. He stood back and eventually followed their lead. Our PSU leadership does not want leaders they seem to support followers Sunga, Bartee, Wilson, and Hannigan. Perhaps having a Council majority of followers for the last 3 decades is why we are in the dire financial position we are in. I was amused at the Henkette bio author Friedman's assessment of the BK hearings apparently he likes followers too.

Vallejo Heights   |September.08.2008 I'm actually going to step in to defend Tom Bosley a bit here (or, as I still think of him, "Mr. C." Specifically, he stated this: "So lets quit this self-serving retoric (sic) and hope that this Mayor and Council, with the City Admistration can ignore so many idotic ramblings and reach out to the Police Association, the Firefighters Local and IBEW and work together to get our City out of this mess. It did not start during Mayor Davis's administration, but at great political damage, he has attempted to get us out of it." We all know that "reaching out" to the IAFF 1186 is like "reaching out" to a great white shark, so we have to take that particular request with a grain of salt. Like a shark, they only know how to consume. They've damaged both the city (and therefore, the citizens) and their fellow unions. If the city has any chance at all of contracting fire services to CalFire, it would be a godsend. What I hear Bosley making here, however, is a cry for peace. (Well, except for characterizing some of the conversation here as "idiotic ramblings." That's not exactly helping, Bosley.) I hereby second the motion for an end to hostilities, or at least a softening of some opinions. The mayor and entire council do deserve some credit for voting unanimously on BK. Yes, their backs were to the wall, but they did the right thing in a time of crisis. That's a good thing. At some point, we need to forgive them for their past sins so that everyone can move forward together. (Note that I did not say "forgive and forget" -- I much prefer "forgive and remember." For example, it wasn't all that long ago that Joanne Schivley was recognized as an enemy by many of us here, when she was banging the drum for the LNG plant. Now, she is seen as a hero. I don't expect the same change in status from all of the unions' friends, but I think that we increase the chances of their changing sides if we lighten up on the rhetoric a bit here. Over on the T-H message boards, there's trolling going on from both sides, and people seem to be jumping a bit too much whenever they see a red cape over here. (I know we all love to fight bulls, or at least BS, but perhaps people are overreacting just a tad?) Eventually, the way forward is going to require cooperation, and since the acknowledged heroes on the council are outnumbered by those who are painted as villains, there's going to be some cooperation involved. Let's see if we can start enabling that here.

Sonic Toad   |September.08.2008 Tom, we are not the same people. I don't post on here very much at all really. Your comment about respect is just a hot button with me. Regarding the chamber, I've never lived in a place that has 3 different chambers of commerce. Since when does "business" have racial separation? The answer = When it's really not about business.

Waz up wid dat   |September.08.2008 "A little birdie" informed me that long term employees 10+ years have no intention of leaving the VPD. Just because the City of Vallejo allows transfering cops to keep their rank, pay, time and benefits of the city they left, does not mean that other cities will do the same for cops leaving Vallejo PD and going to a new city. Dont forget we have the best contracts in the State and the Country. They know that the City of Vallejo is going to work with them, it's "worth" staying. Many of the public safety employees are embarassed that their unions have tried to paint them as overworked, underpaid and treated badly, especially when the VIB and the San Francisco Chron. published what their earnings and benefits are. Its now no secret as to why many of them live in affluent areas, drive luxury autos, have rental properies and vacation homes, people spend what they make, they need more money to keep up the life style. We need to recruit from other states for our VPD, belive me we would get takers if offering a scaled back pay and benefits package, and we might even get employees that live in our city...

silasbarnabe   |September.08.2008 Gomes, Shively, and Tanner = PSU cryptonite. PSU Cryptonite enrages PSU trolls. I love PSU enragement!

On Fire   |September.07.2008 Tom old man, you are indeed a troll. In every sense of the word. You need to take off the blinders and open your eyes. (or rose colored glasses)Who do you think is on the inside pushing for the downtown developement and all of the developers here? The Chamber. They are smoozing and wining and dining them all the time. They are the ones that rush to Council meetings to insist that the Council give them a break on permits and fees. They advocate for a speedy process and giving the developers anything they want. Where have you been? Sitting with you head in the sand? You and others want to blame Gomes and Schively for asking the hard questions, claiming that they are holding up progress but what they are doing is alerting the citizens to the things being pushed by the unions and Chamber. Who do you think is driving the downtown development? The building owners and Chamber buddies. They are the ones crying for cutting deals to let the developers/owners have a break in permit fees and loosening the muni codes. Belvedere cheated the city out of hundreds of thousdands of dollars in reduced fees and who was down there advocating for him? Chamber and their sponsered Council members. The same with the folks out at automall. Who came down to council meetings and spoke out in favor of the project? Chamber and their sponsered council members. The city will probably never see the money owned by Ford or the other dealers. And how much money has the chamber brought to town? Did they help Ford survive? Did they help Yardbyrd survive? What did they do about Linens and Things? What business have they brought to town? Name one? They are self serving and many don't even live in Vallejo? I won't even go into your crazy statement about Martinez and your allegation that he did a lot of good or this city. I will complement Council members when they do something worth complementing. Wilson can't even vote on the major business decisions since he has been on Council. What is it exactly I'm supposed to be complementing him on? Recusing himself? Moving his business out of Vallejo? What would anyone find to complement Hannigan on? She utters two or three words at the most unless she is chastising Tanner on behalf of the unions. What exactly is it you think she deserves to be complemented on? Sunga is a sock puppet for the unions and is only interested in repaying his many sponsers that contributed to his campaign. The vast majority being from outside of Vallejo. The man lied about his education and ran on a "finacial" platform! He tries to get deals for his business buddies and works the hardest for one segement of this community. Again what would I be complementing for? Pulling the wool over our eyes? I could go on and on but you have your head firmly entrenched in the groud so why bother. You think everything is peachy so go right ahead and keep living in your fantasy. Goodness are you that tunnel visioned or addled brained? Why are you here? Do you think your convincing us that you have a clue to what your talking about? No, you simply are a troll. Now go back under a bridge before the daylight arrives.

Tom Bosley   |September.07.2008 Sonic Toad: Since in your infinite wisdom (?)Mayor Davis has not earned your respect yet, you believe you have the right to call him Ozzie. I agree, especially from someone who has earned the right to call themselves: On Fire; Sonic Toad; Silasbarnabee and Sick and Tired. In fact I am amazed it has taken me this long to figure out you are all one and the same and for that you have earned my respect. But here I thought I was having some exchanges with a mulitude of different people. What a waste of time???

Tom Bosley   |September.07.2008 On Fire: There you go again, not reading what is written, just responding to what you "wish" it had said. I do not believe in just using names to back my opinions. My message was in response to remarks made by WATCHING CLOSELY and then agreed to by RICK MARIANI.I only brought out facts on people that they referred to. No one mentioned Mayor Intintoli or anyone else. In fact I said I do not believe in always referring to the past and trying to find who to blame. My comments clearly, stated facts that should be known before you go overboard on complimenting people who have not earned those accolades, while blaming people that were not at all part of the problem. In fact you show your ineptness again, by doing everything you can to pass off criticism. i.e. What does the Chamber have to do with this issue, their job is to help business survive in Vallejo, thereby bringing in more revenues so better the quality of life, so many of you and us would like to have. Why do you have to bring up former City Managers for recommending things to better our City and paing rosy pictures or as you like to say, wheel and deal and then say poor Cloutier and Schively, because they were forced to sign off. Where does it say in our Charter that Councilmembers have to sign off? They are elected to make the policy decisions and then the City Manager is obligated to follow them out, not the other way around. Do you see the fallacy in your logic. If one of the Councilmember you like screws up, its o'k blame the PSU, Mr. Martinez, the Chamber. But if a Councilmember you don't like does something you don'g agree with, you blame them for being on the take, in the pocket of someone or for not listening to the "experts", that they never hired, but are still responsible for their actions.. Now in 2012, if heaven forbid we are still in bankruptcy, only deeper. Who will you blame then you will probably say, "that's alright, our 2 Councilmembers apologized for the mistakes they made in 2008, but if we come out of this better than we are today, I am sure you will only compliment your 2 Councilmembers, even though they are not close to having a majority. My point is all 7 of these individuals are my Councilmembers and I hope they all do the best job they can, I can't ask for anymore than that. By the way, I never referred to VIB'ers in the message you referred too, so again, you either can't read very well or you only determine what I meant by what you wish or want me to say. As far as who I hold in high esteem, you don't have a clue and I am starting to wonder if you have a clue about anything you write.But it is fun to speak with you guys and I am not even a troll, as you like to accuse me of. By the way, my last posting came out Annonymous by mistake, but it was me as always...Have a Happy Day

Sonic Toad   |September.07.2008 Bosley, Perhaps a minor statement in your post, but why an insult to call him Ozzie? You assume that respect comes from the position held. Respect is earned it is not given by the name of a political position. I see no actions deserving respect and I will not respect Ozzie until he earns it. Council Women Gomes and Schivley have earned my respect. They have spoken out when nobody else would. They have asked the hard questions that nobody else would ask. Hannigan basically utters "Here" in response to an attendance check, Wilson asks the most incredibly obvious questions and recuses himself, Bartee continues to act the professional politician trying to please everyone and ride the middle ground. Has anybody told Tommy that he has zero chance to advance past his current position. He's a city council person for heaven's sake not a senator. Plus he's retired already! Sunga, well you all know about that guy. Davis, he continues to work others to ingratiate himself while he keeps proving how inept he is at running OUR council meetings. Sorry, but the expensive suits and the once yearly lawyer routine of "Isn't it True that...." doesn't cut it. No one else on the dais has earned one ounce of my respect other than Gomes and Schivley. I will respect the rights of others to state their opinion to the fullest, but I will not respect a person's position of office unless earned.

Anonymous   |September.07.2008 To sick and tired: like always you intepret my opinion the way you wanted to. You will not look at the facts. I was not an apologist, I was just keeping the facts in front of the public. I did not mention any statements in the local news, as their comments have absolutely nothing to do with the position we are in today. But if you insist of trying to use words to justify you position that the PSU are the only ones that have caused this problem, then look at Councilmembers Schiveley's statement in Decemeber, when she stated " I do not want to hear anything about what the Fire wants to offer to keep us out of bankruptcy, lets file bankruptcy, break the contacts we have already approved (and which she voted for in 2004 & 2005)and get on with it". Now if that is the way a City Offical tells the City Manger how to negotiate, then it shows why the public voted for BA orginally. Why don't you try to look at the whole picture and not just at your own bias. My words were to let readers know, that we have not won yet, we are still bankrupt and the employees are going to play a big part in getting us out of this, rather you like it or not..By the way I wonder how Councilmember Schively would be acting if she had gotten the Union Endorsement which she requested and appeared before them.And how about the deal she cut with the Unions to support her for Mayor, if she voted for the waterfront plan, but when she announced Council instead of Mayor that commitment didn't carry over. (and that Union wasn't the PSU, but Capenters, Plumbers, Electricians and all of the other Trade Unions, another interesting fact, Huh?) At least Councilmember Gomes and Mayor Davis did not request their endorsement..Interesting fact again...Huh??? Before you preach, know your facts or at least check them out.

On Fire   |September.07.2008 Bosley, you made a point of listing the Council members that you felt were at fault for agreeing to the contract extensions, but you left off a few folks. One most notibly was someone you apparently hold in esteem, Mayor Intintoli. So you are apparently selectively assigning blame? And please, the point is not that Wilson and Hannigan are new, they are tools of the unions and their positions clearly show that to be true. Don't get it twisted. If the reality of the budget and finances had not of been apparent, they would have fought to stay the course along with Bartee and Sunga. They were struggling to find a way not to file bankruptcy up until the vote. Hannigan speaks only of her concern about the PS group and very little for the other city employees, and pushes the Chamber's agenda but lacks concern for the rest of the City. She and Wilson maintain this same position now. So yes we do need to keep and eye on how council votes and what they negotiate. When David Martinez was the City Manager, he wheeled and dealed and gave away the farm. There is very little evidence of any full discussion by council discussing the deals that were made. Martinez painted a rosey picture, (no pun intended) about the future economy, making assumptions that the contract deals would pan out if the economy held. Both Schivley and Cloutier acknowledged their mistakes by signing the contracts. Mayor Intintoli was quite another story, being a seasoned policy maker well acquainted with the henkettes and their politics. So excuse me while I have a different opinion from you, being what you call a VIB'er. You did know that this is the VIB site, didn't you?

Sick N Tired of PSU Apologists   |September.07.2008 Mr Bosley None of them(Davis,Sunga,Bartee,Hannigan and Wilson) have ever uttered a word about the PSU contract abuses. However they will discuss/support ad nausium issues that benefit the Chamber of Commerce (who endorsed several of them). Look at the comments made in the newspaper especially those by Ms Hannigan.Is her first priority the citizens of Vallejo or the PSU who endorsed her. You want to defend 4 people who owe their election to the PSU.To the extent possible they try to be apologists for the PSU. They are no better then prior City Councils who gave away the store and helped drive the City into BK. Only a few Council members have been willing to speak out and several who did lost their election. I find your one statement highly offensive-- "I also believe that all government employees are wells paid and their retirements and perks are unbelivable, but I have not seen one of them vote for their own increases". The PSUs gains have been at the expense of the other Unions who have forgone the obscene wages and benefits that the PSU employees now have.

John K   |September.07.2008 Kirk's right, we've been there, done that... it's time for the PSU's to step back and get away from the plate. They need to understand that they're not in the driver's seat now and it's time for them to take a back seat and listen to the advice and counseling of Vallejo's recognized financial experts. Rob Stout should be in charge of providing the finance info. Not the PSU's. Gloster says the union should play a key role in this, but he seems to have ignored what the Judge told him the other day. The union has already FAILED in "working with city officials to craft a comprehensive plan that restores Vallejo's financial stability" and that's why Judge McManus has granted us protection under Chapter 9. I believe that tomorrow he's going to tell the union lawyers that if we could have come to an agreement with the existing contracts we would have done so by now. It's possible he might give the union a couple of days to file their final pleadings, but the Judge has already said he recognizes the urgency in this matter. I'm hoping to hear him rule tomorrow morning from the bench that the contracts can be set aside and new ones negotiated from scratch.

Amazed   |September.07.2008 Sorry, I meant earlier I thought public safety reiring earlier with a higher percentage than the rest of city staff was OK until their salaries skyrocketed into the atmosphere. That is the problem with so much to say and thoughts pouring out sometimes out of order. There is beauty in chaos...

Amazed   |September.07.2008 Mr. Schussel, yes 3% @ 50 is why the city pays about 14% more for PSU employees retiement. I am not sure, but I also think they get their portion of Social Security picked up by the City, everyone else who works for the city pays for S.S., since the city had the opportunity to stop contributing and didn't I think it is citywide including PSU's. VSFCD got out of S.S., but they are a district, just like East Bay MUD. I also must reiterate, 2.7 vs 2.0 was paid for in lieu of raises by the employees. I used to think that was okay until their salries skyrocketed into the stratosphere. As to insurance, I have always had good coverage, my copay is now $15 and have never paid more than 10% of the cost of my plan and that is through 5 employers in the last 25 years. I don't know what the gentleman below has degrees in, but "starting" wages with my small engineering company for an engineer were $50000 ten years ago., and they normally were boosted to $70000 after 2 years, salaried in the office and overtime was paid in the field. I am glad he is happy with his wages, I left my company 5 years ago because like him, my wages were stagnant for 5 years, for an immediate 20k a year increase. Perhaps it is time to look for a new job, or ask for an overdue raise. That is not meant to dispute city wages, their obviously is a problem there, just don't do like Suisun. To save money, they let a private company provide water and sewer services, after they ran it into the ground, they took it back over and now get to fix the many years of neglect left over from a private company maximizing profits. We should learn from others mistakes and not think we can fix everyting by sending it out to private industry.

Tom Bosley   |September.07.2008 To Mariani, Silasbarnabee & Watchingclosely: I cannot believe what you have just written. How can you compliment Schively (Councilmember 8years 1997-2005); Cloutier (Councilmember 8 years 1999-2007) Peasall (Councilmember 4 years 2003-2007) and critcize Mayor Davis, Councilmember's Wilson & Hannigan, who were elected November 2007 (7 months ago). I am not going to say anything about Councilmembers Gomes, Bartee or Sunga because they came into office in 2005 and the mess had alrady been made. In fact if you check will facts you will see that "at least" those 2 had accepted the offer of no raises for the unions, but yes did extend the contracts per the negotiations. But to blame those you have and compliment the ones you did really shows where you true interests are. Stop and think, how can you criticize Wilson, Hannigan and DAvis for sticking up for the Union friends, when they were the majority that allowed the City to file for bankruptcy.How can you say that Davis, Hannigan and Wilson showed NO LEADERSHIP, NO INNOVATION and were RUBBER STAMPS, when they opposed their supporters (the Public Safety Unions, as you like to point out)and most likely caused themselves political damage. Forgeting City Manager Tanner or Mr. Stout, they have to follow the directions of their Policy Board (The City Council) regardless of their personel beliefs or quit. I hate looking back, because at the City Manager stated in an interview yesterday, "no one won, we just found out that legally the City of Vallejo is bankrupt and now he hoped the employee groups would work with him to resolve the problem." I hope so too. But to keep trying to score points by critcizing those that really had to make some tough decisions is wrong and to attempt to place on a pedestal, those who actually caused this problem is doubly wrong. I also believe that all government employees are wells paid and their retirements and perks are unbelivable, but I have not seen one of them vote for their own increases. So lets quit this self-serving retoric and hope that this Mayor and Council, with the City Admistration can ignore so many idotic ramblings and reach out to the Police Association, the Firefighters Local and IBEW and work together to get our City out of this mess. It did not start during Mayor Davis's administration, but at great political damage, he has attempted to get us out of it,As he has said publically, those above mentioned employees group, did attempt to help resolve this mess, during his attempt to mediate the situation, it too bad the past Counci's didn't try too...Lets hope that he, with Council direction, gives clear direction to the City Staff to get us back on track, that is their job. Lastly, It is an insult to refer to him as Ozzy.....His name is Osby Davis and he is the Mayor of the City of Vallejo, regardless if you voted for him or not. He is OUR MAYOR...

Rick Mariani   |September.07.2008 Yes Silas you hit the nail on the head. The leadership shown by Gomes, Shively, Tanner, Pearsol, and Cloutier along with Rob Stout have finally begun the turnaround that Vallejo needs. The support of this site as well has gotten the true word out about the shenanigans of the Fire and Police unions over the years and which continue to be a threat to our citizens. We must all be vigilant to make sure that the Funded Four do not give up the ship again as we are finally bailing out the water that is sinking our city. I must also say the the vitriol and lies and rumors that the PSUs have unloaded upon Gomes and Shively as well as Tanner have only made them stronger in their desire to do the right thing to help us realize our dreams. The fight is far from over, the unions will spend a lot of money in the next election to try to keep their puppets in office and also to keep Binding Arbitration on the charter. We must respond in kind and raise the money to fight them tooth and nail and to keep everyone aware of their antics.

silasbarnabe   |September.07.2008 One of the undeniable realities of this whole financial disaster has been who are leaders in our Government and who are followers. It was Gomes, Shively and Tanner (with Robert Stout) that showed exceptional leadership. It was Gomes and Shively (along with Pearsall and Cloutier) that where able to read the financial realities through Stout and Tanner. It was Gomes and Shively that had the first and only toen meetings with Bankruptcy experts like Robert McConnel. That my friends is leadership! Our Mayor and funded four are nothing but followers no innovation no intitiative just rubber stamps for the PSU's.

Watching Closely   |September.07.2008 Watch the Funded Four + Ozzy very carefully. Tom and Hermie are up for reelection next year and need the Unions desperately. Erin and Michael consider the Unions their pals, and they'll do anything for them. Can you smell their ambition? And Ozzy. We just don't know what he'll do, do we? But after his Union lovefest/press conference last spring and the Grigsby deal, I don't trust him. He has to earn that trust back by not falling for the Union BS again.

waz up wid dat?   |September.07.2008 Ok here is a typical private sector job, I know because this is my "job." I have two B.A.'s and have worked in my profesSion for over 13 years, for three different small business employers, and I think I am doing "pretty good." I live in a nice area of Vallejo, and I "LIVE WITHIN MY MEANS!" Ok, I earn $50,000 a year, my employeer has a 401K and contributes 3% of my gross to my 401K. I contribute the rest (18%)of my gross to my 401K. I have Blue Cross insurance, which my employeer pays for, and my co-pay is $40.00, I use generic rx, and must contribute 20% towards my rx. I get a $500.00 allowance for dental, the rest comes out of my pocket. I think I am an "average Joe/Jane." I dont think my employeer is taking advantage of me, and I am not taking advantage of him (BTW, I have worked at my current job 4 years, no raise,but I get a small gas allowance.) My spouse is "self employeed," in the construction field that requires him to be on a roof or a ladder 80% of the time. He get double taxation, pays for his own Kaiser and Dental. He has fallen and injured him self and had to rely on his disablity insurance (that he paid for himself) and his savings. We are not "getting rich" but we are doing fine and enjoying our life. We dont own rentals properies, vacation homes, boats,take exotic vacations, or live in an affluent areas like Marin, Sonoma/Napa County or San Francisco. We are happy and have a nice life, did I mention "we live within our means?" We are the average Joe and Jane, and our city employees would have a melt down if they thought they would have to live on a "normal" private sector wage. Viva Vallejo!

ITeNdTObELieVE   |September.07.2008 that the city council has to be watched very carefully, because we may end of right back where we started. And, that would be a shame.

Robert Schussel   |September.07.2008 Amazed I have always maintained that Vallejo must be competitiive in the market place.However for PSU employees the equation is highly skewed. I would like to point out that the Federal Government pension program (with a 7% employee contribution)guarantees 56% of ones salary at age 55 with 30 years service--not the 90% at age 50 PSU employees get. The federal governments pension program would be equivalent to a 1.87%@55 with 30 years of service. It should also be noted that employees get credit for working in other cities etc. People in the private sector don't typically get any pension credit for working for another company etc. I don't see why most PSU employees couldn't work untill at least age 55. Maybe 2%@55 makes more sense but clearly 3%@50 needs to be eliminated. As to actual wages I do agree that the City may not be competitive in some lower level positions but overall wages are as good or better than the private sector.A valid wage comparision study should be done. The rich benefits offered by the City are not available in the private sector. As I stated earlier City Employees need to start contributing to the cost of healthcare insurance etc --possibly a sliding scale based on gross wages. PS could someone help me by specifying what the City would need to do to stop problems with wage compaction.

Kirk   |September.07.2008 Absolutely SHAMELESS! And this group of just-don't-get-its, and I'm guessing their are few if any finance majors in this group, continue to offer help in crafting a "comprehensive plan" to rescue Vallejo. UNBELEIVABLE! "We are willing to continue working with city officials to craft a comprehensive plan that restores Vallejo's financial stability and allows us to continue providing vital services to the people of our community ..." Been there! Done that! Time for PSU's to shut up already! There's got to be a cultural problem/deficiency in these PS departments.

VHS   |September.07.2008 Are you nuts, Some of us have searched the web for hours looking for longevity data broken down by specific occupation and could only find a study done in Germany that focused on longevity and the effects of the fire fighting job. Can you post a link to the PERS studies or give us a starting point on where to find the data youre talking about?

silasbarnabe   |September.07.2008 Studies show many things and that the life expectancy is shorter "after" retirement. This suggests the longer a cop works the longer they live. You also might want to check out the addiction issues being a major cause of death after retirement, and from the boozing and posting I have seen the last several years I would have to agree. http://www.cophealth.com/

Are you nuts?   |September.06.2008 65 year old cops fighting 18 year old thugs? Fact: They got the 3@50 because PERS actuarials showed only 15% of police got to pension and then lived only to 57 years old.

Another Opinion   |September.06.2008 Man At Work, It is wonderful you feel that way, shall we do that with all of our employees, Tree Maintenance, Street Workers, Auto Mechanics, Utility Mechanics, Electricians. These are some of the people that do extensive manual labor, are we gonna find cushy jobs for them, too? It isn't as simple as that. We can keep the workers later, but they definitely can't keep pace if they have been working hard their whole lives, and will probably go out on a disability retirement before 65 anyway. This isn't gonna be a simple fix. By the way, not everyone who works for the city started at age 18, many started in their 30's and 40's. They are able to take retirement starting at 50, but like social security at 62 vs 65, it is at a reduced amount, and many are unable to retire at 55 because they just can't afford it. It would be nice if this were simple, but it is not. On a positive note, due to the extreme savings to the city for a 2% at 65 plan, the employees wouldn't have to come out of pocket anymore, wow, an immediate 9% raise.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.06.2008 Dean Gloster: 19.4� a second. How would you like to be paid two dimes everytime you exhale? Nice.......How much did the unions pay for him to write this rubbish? $1,400? GET A CLUE: WE ARE BANKRUPT! You can blame who ever you want. But do you care about Vallejo? You spin and spin and spin even after the respected judge's ruling? Obviously you care nothing for Vallejoans and you all need to go!

On Fire   |September.06.2008 Attorney Dean ($700 an hour) Gloster still spewing bogus data! The judge has turned on the fans that removed the smoke from the room. He took down the mirrors the unions carefully placed around the room to give the illusion of creditability. The judge de-bunked the union's contention that city staff did things unlawfully. What is it about the ruling that they don't get? Cut the crap henkettes! Save your money and try to buy some intergrity.....and a clue!

Amazed   |September.06.2008 Mr. Schussel, I agree that the city has and has had a problem and that bankruptcy was necessary. We are very management heavy and need serious re-negotiations of safety contracts. However, while you are spewing your ideas, take into account, IBEW and CAMP both fully paid for 2.7% versus 2% @ 55 out of their pay raises. 2% @ 65, that is pretty funny, we have a hard time attracting educated people for our blue collared technical jobs now, why, seems pay "is" a problem in some cases. Seems there is a disparity in our city, some are overcompensated while others are exactly the opposite. There is an alleged salary survey going on. If we are lucky, maybe we can fix some of the damage. If we don't want our experienced people leaving in droves, we had better be careful about what we do. Trust me, there are positions in the city that won't be refilled easily if at all without equitable compensation. None of our employess just work for the benefit of the city, they have families and mortgages, too. The final cost may be more than we currently pay. I am all too aware that 3% @ 50 is quite excessive considering the change was from 2% and considering the city pays, I believe, 28% of the contribution (vs about 14% for CAMP and IBEW). From a limited look at various cities across the nation, this has become an epidemic with PSU's. Their retirement compensations are much greater than the rest of the city workers. Orange County's lawsuit may have an effect on compensation prior to the increases given 7+ years ago, although I am not quite clear if this is a cost to PERS or to the city. Obviously, we still need to be competitive. We can't just stop paying our bills, remember, we are still keeping the house we live in, Chapter 9, remember?!

Man at Work   |September.06.2008 NeedMoreInfo, I think the firefighters should be able to stop fighting fires at 55 because physically they can't do the job after that. But instead of retiring, they can then move into another job in the city that isn't so physical and they can retire at 65 like the rest of us working folk.

Anonymous   |September.06.2008 http://www.fire.ca.gov/communications/downloads/fact_sheets/FireandEmergencyResponse.pdf

Anonymous   |September.06.2008 http://www.fire.ca.gov/communications/downloads/fact_sheets/Glance.pdf

Cal Fire can manage Vallejo   |September.06.2008 Exerpt from Riveside County Fire web site: http://www.rvcfire.org/opencms/about_us/ County Fire Department is one of the largest regional fire service organizations in California. The Department responded to 110,224 incidents during the 2005 calendar year. The Department is staffed with approximately 952 career and 1,100 volunteer personnel, and currently serves approximately 2 million residents in an area of 7,004 square miles. This service area consists of the unincorporated county areas; sixteen contract cities, and one Community Service District (CSD). The Cities and CSD Proudly Served are: Banning Beaumont Calimesa Canyon Lake Coachella Desert Hot Springs Lake Elsinore Indian Wells Indio La Quinta Moreno Valley Palm Desert Perris Rancho Mirage San Jacinto Temecula Rubidoux Community Services District The RCOFD operates 93 fire stations in 17 battalions, providing fire suppression, emergency medical, rescue, and fire prevention services. The department

need more info   |September.06.2008 Mr. Schussel, Your consideration of 2%@65 for all PERS, you mean you want to have a firefighter that is 65 years old still working to make retirement?

Inside City Hall   |September.06.2008 A police captain is comparable to a deputy chief in the FD. Deputy chief's aren't part of the union. Captains in the PD were allowed to be part of VPOA just a year or so ago -- it was part of yet another "deal" offered by the unions to "save" the city from yet another budget crisis. Not mentioned at the time was that when captains went into VPOA they got an automatic 10% pay raise because of compaction issues they didnt have in CAMP. Rotten deal for the City. Again. Police captains should never have been allowed to be part of the union and need to be removed from VPOA.

2-Wheeler   |September.06.2008 Anonymous, I'm not all bitter, I would just like to see individuals doing research into Cal Fire before the idea is brought up. Facts are facts. Cal Fire (CDF) goes through an extensive process when determining whether or not to take over fire services in a specific region. CDF looks into issues such as a cities financial situation, population, projected growth, etc. i would never "trash talk" CDF, they are a very respected organization and provide a great service for "their" area of responsibility. I would also like to know what Medic Ambulance has to do with the situation as well.

question   |September.06.2008 Robert, what would be accomplished by trying to make captains a "management" position? Captains in the FD are a line job, meaning they are part of a crew at a station and they work 48-hour shifts. Are you trying to suggest removing them from the union? Or making them salary?

Robert Schussel   |September.06.2008 #7) Upper ranks like Captains,Lieutenant etc should be reclassified to management postions.

Robert Schussel   |September.06.2008 I posted these comments on the TH site but also wanted to share them here. 1) PSU employees need to be paid a competitive wage. On the one hand $50K a year is too low but $113K for an experienced officer is too high. There is a marketplace and Vallejo needs to set a wage that will get some to come here. 2) Educational and Longevity incentives need to be eliminated for all positions in Vallejo.It is crazy to provide an additional 20% to ones wages for this. Instead moving up to the next rank should include a specfic statement about the number of additional years of experience and course work required. Specfic courses or majors need to cited. 3)There should be one set of benefits for City employees regardless of the type of work one does with the possible exception of a clothing allowance. 4) Employees should have to contribute toward health insurance and related benefits.My experience in the healthcare industry suggests that some type of sliding scale be used. If an employees gross wages are less than 50,000 they pay x% of the health insurance costs. If they make 50,001 to 100,000 they pay an additional amount and if one makes over 100K they pay an even higher percentage of the real cost. 5) Ideally retirement should be a defined contribution rather than a defined benefit. The 3%@50 with a cost of living clause is unheard of in the private sector and is finanically killing Vallejo. All City employees should be put into a system more like a 401K in which the City will match an employees contribution for retirement. For example for every dollar an employee uses for retirement up to 10%(of gross wages with Overtime excluded) the City match will be a $1.50. A fall back position. For all employees PERS contributions should 2%@65 and no Cost of Living.The reason I say this is the reality that most Citys still have overly generous retirement packages and Vallejo will need to compete. 6) Binding arbitration and minimum staffing needs to be eliminated.

Anonymous   |September.06.2008 Sounds like you're a little bitter, 2-wheeler. Facts are facts -- CalFire didn't want to get into the 1186 vendetta/battle. But with you all trash talking them, I'm sure they'll think differently in the future. 1186 and Henke's personal vendettas ruined the reputation of IAFF and clued other cities in on their negotiating tatics and greed. VPOA and lapdogs IBEW let themselves get dragged into a fight they didn't need to be in. Game is over boys. Welcome CalFire and Medic Ambulance!!

Wonderment   |September.06.2008 Thanks 2-Wheeler for that info. I'd heard from multiple source that Cal Fire was non-union, so I checked into it myself. As an FYI the state Cal Fire site says nothing about the unions, at least that I could find, but the IAFF 2881 site does. Switching to Cal Fire is still a good idea. Given the political animosity I don't think we can trust the current Union to negotiate in good faith, even now. Switching to Cal Fire would bring in new blood and and past the bruised egos, which would be a good start. Vallejo's union has clearly demonstrated it does not have it's members' long term interest at heart, if they'd prefer the risk of bankruptcy over insuring their member still have jobs. That type of hubris cannot be rewarded. I'd never been more disgusted in my life when I read that the 4-year contract extension on a shell game financial plan was in part a ploy to increase their claim when the city later declared bankruptcy. The bums have to go.

2-Wheeler   |September.06.2008 Anonymous, take the time to do some research before you make irresponsible comments. I don't understand your IAFF bashing since CDF (Cal Fire) is part of the IAFF. It's easy enough to look these things up online. Take a look at IAFF local 2881 and the Cal Fire web site before you make uneducated statements.

RdP   |September.06.2008 Re. the contracts...as the City is in bankruptcy, doesn't the Judge have to approve any contracts negotiated? After he revokes the current ones, that is. I believe until we emerge from bankruptcy with a discharge...the Judge must still approve everything. Does anyone know if this is the case for municipal bankruptcies as well as for personal and business bankruptcies?

Anonymous   |September.06.2008 Don't hold your breath, WaR. The Times Horrid will NEVER give credit to Tanner, Schivley or Gomes because they dared to poke their fingers in the eyes of their union buddies, their Chamber cronies and their very own rag. Doesn't matter that they were doing it to try and save our city. They made them all look inept and obsolete, our good old boys.

WaR   |September.06.2008 VALLEJO TIMES HERALD: How Long Until It Practices "Truth In Reporting?" For Instance, what is it that keeps Publisher: Ron Rhea, Edit: Ted Vollmer, Edit: Dick Freedman and others at the Times Herald from giving credit where credit is due? In other words, leaving certain names out when these same names/persons are ones they have constantly felt justified when insulting, condemning or even vilifying in the public eye, usually when it helped to bolster the agendas of Kurt Henke, Jon Riley, Ron Rhea, Ted Vollmer, and even Dick Freedman... All of which are Over-Devoted Members of the ALL RULING Vallejo Chamber of Commerce. For example, in this instance an Honest, Non-Biased newspaper would have read more like this: Earlier this year after City Manager: Joe Tanner & Councilmembers Stephanie Gomes and Joanne Schivley, "the ONLY City officials to WARN us, "Without drastic steps to file Chapter 9 the City of Vallejo WILL run out of money before the end of the year due to bank-breaking payrolls going to fire and police payrolls, etc.... But instead, This City's Mayor, along with four of its Council members' loyal only to Henke, Riley and this newspaper, decided to put Vallejo's Citizenry in the dark while trying to publically censure Tanner, Schivley & Gomes by smearing and vilifying these individuals whom, if for no other reason than promising their constituency "political integrity", were the only ones being truly honest with us "the voters." So, the way I see it is our real heroes here are those who gave us TRUTH at all cost... rather than the chocolate dipped BS the others tried feeding us. In closing, while NOT PROUD of the bankruptcy outcome, I now am able to see a light at the other end of the tunnel and this time it's not a fire truck driven at 100 mph by Henke or his "HOOK and CROOKS." This is how the ORIGINAL PARAGRAPH READ. More than likely after being edited by the "Chamber-Clique." "Hint of a likely Chapter 9 bankruptcy filing came earlier this year after city officials warned that the city had spent more than it was receiving in revenue, and would run out of money before the end of the year - without drastic steps." J.A.York VTH Sept/06/08

Anonymous   |September.05.2008 Sorry 2-Wheeler, CalFire didn't do a study. They said they didn't want to come to Vallejo because of IAFF. But if all you golden boys leave, CalFire will have to come in and provide services. And keep on trash talking them. Maybe next time the City asks them to come to Vallejo they'll tell you all in IAFF to eat dirt. Hello CalFire, our community welcomes you and know you will provide excellent service. You take care of fire, and we'll hire Medic Ambulance to provide medical services. For less cost than the IAFF 1186 golden boys.

2 Wheeler   |September.05.2008 Don't be so quick to praise Cal Fire. If you remember, not too long ago Cal Fire did a study on taking over fire services in Vallejo. After this study the city was scored very low and once again Cal Fire stated they would NOT be interested in taking over fire services. Furthermore, if you look into other cities Cal Fire contracts with, you would see that fire services are substandard compared to the service that the Vallejo Fire Department provides.

overpaid   |September.05.2008 huge kudos to mark and his excellent reporting. Isn't there some reporting prize we can nominate him for? Wow!

captain   |September.05.2008 Judge rules Vallejo meets bankruptcy requirements http://www.timesheraldonline.com/ci_10390651

captain   |September.05.2008 CONGRATS TO THE CITIZENS OF VALLEJO!!!

silasbarnabe   |September.05.2008 Hmmm I wonder if now that we are officially in Bankruptcy that if the Council continues its give away the store policy that some form of "negligence" and perhpas criminal charges per the RICO statutes might now apply? Claiming stupidity or blaming stupidity has gotten the council majority to where we are now, but with a BK rap gorilla on their shoulders I wonder if they will continue to give away the store. One thing is for sure we cannot add more funds to their power to give away the store. I agree with firebug no more taxes until binding arbitration is removed at the very least and we can do so with a defacto minority (not that I believe for a minute that we are a minority any longer).

Hey Nonny Nonny   |September.05.2008 Bringing in CalFire would be the best thing that could happen, and perhaps even the funded four will realize it. If they are going to have to go against their benefactors, and it sure looks like that's going to be necessary, bringing in CalFire is a way to remove the IAFF from the political landscape and avoid reprisals. (They do seem to be quite a vindictive lot!)

Pyriphlegethon   |September.05.2008 Cal Fire! If the contracts are voided on Monday (highly likely based on the tone of the judge's report) and all the firefighters leave as they keep threatening to do, we can finally contract with Cal Fire!!!

Fed Up   |September.05.2008 Thank God for the Judge!! This is the best news hit Vallejo in 20 years. Time to start looking at what Cal Fire can do for us here in Vallejo. Time for a major reorg.

robert schussel   |September.05.2008 Firebug I don't think a lack of money has stopped prior City Councils from giving away the store. For example the 3%@50 benefit took years before its full effect was seen. I still remember Citizens begging City Council(Schivley was a member)not to extend the Contract as once various concessions expired the City would not be able to afford the wages etc.No one on the City Council was willing to speak out. I seriously doubt that today most members of the Council are willing to go against their biggest source of campaign funds. They will try to restore as many benefits,wage schedules etc as possible. I am not very optomistic that they have the will to do the right thing.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.05.2008 The judge RIPPED Mialocq's Rose Report and testimony apart. Go to page 31 and start reading pp 100. We were RIGHT all along! I think Ron York should go back and post his comments of yesterday when he mistakenly took the city's filing for the judges opinion!

Firebug   |September.05.2008 Robert and Py, To give something away they will need to have something to give and that is money. We now must not vote on any tax what so ever until BA is removed. Even with a 34 percent voting minority (which I believe is now much greater) we can still control the council by controlling their purse strings

Robert Schussel   |September.05.2008 My biggest concern is that members of City council will try to give back to the PSU most of the incentives, wages and benefits that caused the judge to rule in the Citys favor.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.05.2008 Excellent point, Firebug! Yes, an appeal will certainly show the unions' true colors, won't it? It will show they care about their salaries and benefits and NOT about Vallejo. And its not like Vallejo will be able to cut them all that deeply in BK court, I suppose. They will very likely still end up with excellent salaries and benefits.

On Fire   |September.05.2008 Guess the so called "VIB'ers" aren't so crazy after all for believing our City officials? We tried to tell people that there was no hidden money. We tried to tell people that you couldn't take restricted funds and pay salaries. We tried to tell people that the City had not illegally funded the transporation fund of the redevelopment fund. But all we got was grief, called freaks and idiots. (and that's the nice words) It's time for the ney sayers to look at the city in another way. A new way. Restructuring and rebuilding. Like the phoenix, we will rise again. Already the ps employees and their followers are making threats a new instead of coming up with solutions that are real and helping to save the city. We will be met with harse words and fear mongering, but stay strong Vallejo. We will come out of this and we will be moving in the right direction. Viva Vallejo!

Firebug   |September.05.2008 Sonic, Just like all their hot air about hidden money has now been proven to be lies, if they appeal all their hot air about wanting to help the City or how much they love the City will also be shown. This will be a tough balancing act for them convincing the public to trust them again about not removing BA while appealing the BK decision costing the City even more money.

Sonic Toad   |September.05.2008 Standby for Sirens Galore This Weekend! But it's a moot point considering that this is not a court of public opinion. After a favorable ruling to at least partially rework the Union contracts on Monday the city will hopefully be in a position to stabilize spending and services while I'm sure another court battle or two will be in process. Far from over until we get BA off the charter and can be like the other 95% of California. All employees should receive fair wages, but unfortunately with the circle of wealth salary comparisons it's difficult to determine what is really fair. How about New York City plus a cost of living adjustment?

Firebug   |September.05.2008 A new vallejo is dawning, one down two more to go, throw out contracts, and eliminate BA.

Sonic Toad   |September.05.2008 Denied! Go to the last couple of pages http://tinyurl.com/62b524 http://www.policepay.net/vallejofindingoffact.pdf

momster   |September.05.2008 didn't seem that interested in cathing the killer. She felt the cops may have knew her killer and was closely connected.

momster   |September.05.2008 1999 I moved back home to tend to my ill mother who was given 6 months to live.Her best friend at the time was allegedly murder by the Zodiac.My mother opened up to me and spoke of the incident.She mentioned her friend dating a cop. She said that the cops didn

Firebug   |September.05.2008 Anony, Your list of PSU bashers reminds of the Merry little missive the Zodiac killer wrote in 1971 called "I have a little list". Can those of us on the list expect some kind of nasty retribution?

On Fire   |September.05.2008 Anony, first of all, just to put things into the right prospective, I wouldn't consider it a massive defeat for just myself. It would be a defeat for all of the people of Vallejo who would suffer from the decision. Simply put, more services cut, city hall shut down for part of the day, more layoffs. As reported this morning, the country is in a situation worse than a recession. More unemployment, no change expected for any economic improvement at least until next year sometime. So for those who are banking on the situation in Vallejo to change just from "more revenues", it ain't going to happen anytime soon. Spending has to be cut. In either case, contrary to your belief, I would not be celebrating bankruptcy. I would however be cheering the fact the the judge would validate what many taxpayers in Vallejo have been saying all along, the salaries and benefits are unsustainable. Now if you would want to bask in what you appear to see as a win by having the contracts stay intact, go ahead. You either don't live in Vallejo or just don't care about the consequences of keeping the contracts intact. In either case, just don't to to make us be stupid with you. Finally, what's an "ect"?

Anonymous   |September.05.2008 With that said, no matter what the judge rules, IF he leaves the contracts in place, it is a massive defeat for the PSU bashers. ie Pot Belly, Silas, On Fire, Welfare Queen, Sam .... ect, ect, ect ... (in case he hasn't already been mentioned at least once before)

Anonymous   |September.05.2008 Doug, the judge asked for both sides to submit their facts and findings in electronic form so he could cut/paste from each to form his final ruling. His final ruling won't look like either submitted document, though, as it will reflect his own opinion on what he read and heard throughout the trial. It wont, as Mr. York reported, be any side 100 and the other zero. But I'll wager, based on all the testimony, that the City will prevail overall, with a few points taken from the Unions. One side is rarely 100% right!

Doug Sherman   |September.05.2008 For all of us non lawyer types could someone shed some light on how this process works? It appears to me that each side will draft their version of how the final decision should read and submit it to the court. The Judge then reviews both proposals and signs the one he agrees with? What happens if there are a few points within the successful draft the Judge does not agree with? Does the draft go back to the winning side for a rewrite? Thanks in advance.

John K   |September.05.2008 From one of the times-horrid blogs: It was just a drill. The motion to reject the collective bargaining agreements is scheduled for hearing on Monday the 8th. Ron York's comments were wonderful, were they not? He may be able to recycle them for the actual decision, which should arrive any day. Hopelessly optimistic, here's a recap of some of the more delightful comments from Mr. York: The city did not just win, the unions were slaughtered. ...the judge liked and trusted the city's witnesses and did not like or trust the union's witness. Much was made of the fact that the four key people in the city's finance department were certified public accountants and the union's had none. The decision entirely adopts the testimony and documents of the city and totally rejects the union's witness and exhibits. The union's case was slapped down on every issue. Considering that Judge McManus is the senior judge at the Sacramento courthouse and has many years of experience, the proceedings can only be described as a massacre. It was obvious that the judge did not like or trust Mr. Roger Mialocq. The City of Vallejo 100 and the unions zilch. Doesn't take much imagination to see that the PolicePay editor was reading a document entitled, "City's Proposed Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law"

Messenger   |September.04.2008 That's a hoot BooBoo! The blame for where we are ultimately lies at the feet of the PSUs and all of their bought and sold council members through the years. Greed, power and corruption. Ya just took it too far and you're reaping what you sowed. Don't shoot the messengers.

Sonic Toad   |September.04.2008 ummm boo boo, PolicePay did post that report which is what was referenced as the source. I'm pretty sure that the editor didn't consult "hatred" and "intolerance" who happen to be in Minnesota at the moment. When "hatred" and "intolerance" are back in town I'll let you know. I believe that they feel used and abused by the Union Leadership. I am quite sure however that "hope for a new future" is taking up residency.

On Fire   |September.04.2008 Boo, if you will note, this was posted by a POLICE consultant, who by his blog postings, was supposedly someone on the inside track. The comments came from York, which people reacted to. Even the people on the other side of this were commenting on it. So if you want to be mad, send a post to Ron York. It was his error, not ours. Boo who?

On Fire   |September.04.2008 Cheryl did it. She submitted the report and it's all her fault.

Boo Boo   |September.04.2008 The problem is your so blinded by hate and intolerance that you prematurely report that there was a decision when there wasn't. Then you do just what Gomes and company do, you blame someone else,police pay in this case. Try to maintain some objectivity.

On Fire   |September.04.2008 Thanks Marc, I think. What a waste of energy. I was thinking of posting a couple of weeks back about posting on Ron's website and suggesting that he go to work for Harvey Rose since he is a CPA and all but somehow I don't think they would have him now. But hey, his interpretation of facts is just as bad as Harvey and bunch so maybe they would. Harvey "we don't know what we are talking about" Rose. A entire firm of peope who can't interpret documents! Hrumph!

Edinator   |September.04.2008 Police Pay has just printed a retraction. Looks like it was an honest misinterpretation of a confusing document. Honestly, I wasn't at all sure what the document was myself until I spoke with Robert McConnell. I guess we're all pretty tense on both sides.

silasbarnabe   |September.04.2008 Thanks Marc as I suspected the folks at Policepay are nothing more than Union advocates. I think those of us on VIB should take note what a piece of scum Mr. York is for putting out a fake news piece...

John K   |September.04.2008 DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN Settle down, folks. Regardless which way the Judge rules, Vallejo has a lot of work to do to recover. Remember, we're still bankrupt.

Pyriphlegethon   |September.04.2008 And I am now printing out the 44 page document...oh well!

silasbarnabe   |September.04.2008 Has anyone picked this up on any major network yet? I do buy the City prevailed to move forward but the "voiding of contracts" I am not so certain about.

RdP   |September.04.2008 I guess our celebration must wait...thanks VIB for setting this straight (I think...)

Truth Teller   |September.04.2008 Two of my favorite lines from Mr. York: "Considering that Judge McManus is the senior judge at the Sacramento courthouse and has many years of experience, the proceedings can only be described as a massacre." "It was obvious that the judge did not like or trust Mr. Roger Mialocq." And dessert: "The City of Vallejo 100 and the unions zilch. Marc Levinson did a great job. Mr. Levinson, I salute you and offer my congratulations."

i love vallejo   |September.04.2008 Ding Dong the Witch is Dead Which Old Witch? The Wicked Witch! Ding Dong the Wicked Witch is Dead...... Hey Henke.... Dorothys house just fell on you!

RdP   |September.04.2008 Oh my, this is huge news! I've been checking the Times Herald for breaking news on this decision, and there has been nothing. I checked the policepay info and it appears the decision came out around 2PM. GO TANNER!!!!

Vallejo Visitor   |September.04.2008 Vallejo wins big in court and judge throws out the union contracts. Check out this report from policepay... http://policepay.blogspot.com/ EDITORIAL COMMENT The following remarks are my evaluation of Judge Michael McManus' decision. Although critical, none of my remarks are meant to challenge the judgment or integrity of Judge McManus. I have no reason to doubt that he is a good and honest person. I am a firm believer in our system of justice and as such have the highest respect for those who serve on the bench. The city did not just win, the unions were slaughtered. One thing that was very apparent was that the judge liked and trusted the city's witnesses and did not like or trust the union's witness. Much was made of the fact that the four key people in the city's finance department were certified public accountants and the union's had none. I am a certified public accountant and I do not see the lack of a CPA title as a disqualification. The decision entirely adopts the testimony and documents of the city and totally rejects the union's witness and exhibits.

Firebug   |September.04.2008 Even the pro-PSU officials are saying they think the City will prevail even though they are wrong, at least that is what Mr. York alluded to.

John K   |September.04.2008 Hurry up and wait. No doubt Jessica has used the extra time to write 2 different stories, one for BK approved and the other for BK denied. How about you, Marc? Are you ready to publish in either direction?

Bo Bo   |September.03.2008 Didn't know Bush was running

On Fire   |September.03.2008 Oh I don't know. I understand that Mrs. Palin applied for her first passport last year. Which means? Yes, she had never been out of the country. With the exception of maybe Canada and Mexico prior to the new passport rules. So okay, say she is the VP and now has to meet with foreign Heads of State. That should make for good relations, "I've never been there but I'm sure it's a nice country!" If, heaven forbid, they were to get into office and something were to happen to th President, I'd feel much more assured that things wouldn't fall apart if Biden were to take over than Mrs. Palin. Sorry, big difference and everyone knows it. You can't beat up on Obama about foreign policy and the lack of experience and then bring in someone on the other side that's never been out of the Country in her whole life. McCain is pandering to the conservative christian right and that's a big concern of itself. Hell, four more years of Bush/Chaney/McCain, without even considering Palin, is enough to make one want to puke!

Anonymous   |September.03.2008 The thing that is so comical is the complaint that Palin does not have the experience to be President. Her critics assure us that if she had the proper credentials they would have no problem with her as a legitimate candidate and the only reason McCain put a woman on the ticket was to get votes. If all that is true, why didnt Obama put Hillary on the ticket? I mean, she had the experience and got the same number of votes as he did in the primary. Why did Obama put Biden on the ticket? To get votes?

i love vallejo   |September.03.2008 so i have a simple question palins daughter is 17 and her bf is 18 isn't that considered statutory rape of a minor? and they call themselves the family values party, if biden had a 17 yr old daughter who was pregnant the religious right would be screaming for his head.

Wonderment   |September.03.2008 If the topic is Palin, here's my 2 cents. Palin can be either an insain choice, or a sensble one depending on your political perspective. Palin brings McCain a backing he'd been lacking, the religious right. They're even willing to overlook her daughter's pregnancy as a "family matter" which they'd crucify a Dem candidate for. The hypocrisy overwhelms me - a pregnant daughter is private matter, yet choice for women is not. Another nail in the coffin to their argument for absetency only educations - as I heard from the convention floor this normal anyone who doesn't have problems with their teenagers isn't normal. I can't see how it is more acceptable for a teen to shoulder the burden of becoming a mother than to understand the risks from the sex she was having. No matter what I don't like about her I certainly respect her dedication to the job. Showing up days after she's given birth to a baby with downs syndrome, in light colored pants to boot at work takes guts, all the more so because of the double standard. She may play up "hockey mom" bit but since then she's done well in the demanding, ultra masculine state of Alaska. It's too bad the VP job was handed to her as a political stunt and not because of hard work. She'd not had enough time in office to see if she was effective or not. I don't believe these arguments about her not caring for her kids well enough for a minute - she's married isn't she? If one spouse has a demanding job, the other can pick up the slack. She's not a single mom, to say she's got to do it all is sexist. You can't do the type of thing she's done and have a family without a spouse who fills in behind - women have been doing that for years for men and it's time to realize the tables can be turned. Heck, Michelle Obama provided for her family while her husband's political career got underway, and so did Hillary. McCain left his first wife to marry an heiress who could support him in style. Let Palin's husband take care of the kids. Fathers are just as capable as mothers. Still, when it comes down to it, I can't stand her politics. She's an ideologue, and got backing from the party because of it (even as a Podunk mayor in a non-partisan race). She's a party creature for sure, and a reformer simply because she wasn't groomed by the Alaskan establishment and didn't owe them anything. Even as mayor she asked people to resign if they didn't explicitly support her. That isn't what I think of when I think of McCain. I'm moderate, and I used to back McCain. I'm rather scared of some of fiscal philosophies exposed by the extreme left (which Obama has not done a good job of assuiding me of), and had been hopeful that McCain's pandering is just that - that he'll throw off irresponsible tax promises and revert to his true stance of a fiscal conservative. Palin seals the deal - he's more concerned about religious conservatives than he is about independents. He's moved to that Republican block mentality, the same one that has paralized our state government now for months. With Palin as his VP, I can't imagine him softening back to a free-thinking Republican, or what would happen if his age catches up to him. Palin makes McCain no longer worth the risk.

Curious   |September.02.2008 There seems to be a disconnect between the Christian Right's belief that women should stay home and make babies so America has enough cannon fodder and pushing one of those fragile creatures into a key political position. Sarah could end up as president. Talk about "Idiocracy"! I've been told that "man is the head of the house even as Christ is head of the Church" by a bonafide Christian fundamentalist. So is Sarah just supposed to do what she is told by some man??? Who??? All the other Christian Right women at the Republican convention are wearing the proper frocks and looking adoringly at their husbands...all except Sarah. I don't think many of them would consider "dressing a moose" proper feminine deportment. And that poor 17 year old whose boyfriend Levi doesn't sound like he wants to get tied down. Her life is collapsing and she had to stand on a stage with a smile pasted over her "deer in the headlights" gaze at the audience. What a tragedy for the poor child (I mean the 17 year old).

On Fire   |September.02.2008 Someone earlier asked about Sarah Palin and it appears that the McCain people made a big mistake in judgement with this woman, No real vetting process, now they are backtracking to do a more through job. What were they thinking by dragging this woman and her family through what's to come? I for one am tired of this whole issue on whether or not a mother of five, even including the newborn with special needs, can hold office. But what is bothersome is the fact that her 17 year old is now being dragged through the media, and her life and business exposed to the world. Mrs. Paylin appears to be ambitious, but not close to being qualified to hold the office of V. President. Her party would like the world to think that her daughter's pregnacy is no big deal, yet they went out of their way to have Bristol holding her brother during the entire press conference, with a blanket tactfully drapped across what would be a round tummy. I wondered why Mrs. Palin never once took her child or even her husband. Bristol stood holding her brother with the blanket covering her entire mid section, looking uncomfortable. No one holds heir blanket with it drapped over their entire body. You either have the baby wrapped or have the blanket on your shoulder incase of milk spitups. It was apparent that they were trying to camouflage the daughter's pregnacy, but why? If is isn't a big deal like they say, why the coverup on stage? Seems like the party that loves preaching and dictating morality is having a tartuffe moment. I'm sure that more will follow.

overpaid   |September.02.2008 all those public safety people who have left? it's not because of the emotional pain of seeing V-ton in bankruptcy...it's because of the GOLDEN retirement benefits and the SUPER EASY disability retirement that enables them to cash it all out, tax free. GRAB IT WHILE YOU CAN boys, it's the name of the game.

TRolL aLErT   |September.02.2008 Sometimes trolls that flame to the extreme are exiled back under the bridge by the TrOLl PAtROl.

Anonymous   |September.02.2008 For the record, VIB doesn't delte Troll posts. We just ignore the Trolls so they go back to the Times Horrid to play their stupid games.

Just call me a troll   |September.02.2008 Definition of Troll in VIBese: Anyone who doesn't agree, or doesn't side with, what those on the blog subscribe to. An individual who won't abandon their own beliefs and become one of the group. Basically, someone with their own brain, that does not feel the need to have others high-five, or slap their back in support. A troll will almost always have their posting removed so as not to upset the harmonic aura of the website.

Wonderment   |September.02.2008 The Bond Buyer, a public finance newspaper, has an article on Vallejo's BK filing today http://www.bondbuyer.com/article?id=20080829JEO4SI4J It does take a pro-creditor stance (Muni BK is a threat to their audience of banks and investors) but they are very clear in describing the legalities of Ch 9 BK and the difficulties the union face. From the position of a creditor, Ch 9 is a more difficult spot to be in than a standard BK. While part of me is glad to see the advantage the city has, we've got to remember that we're putting the city's other creditors in a bad position. And that isn't a good thing. Is any one else annoyed that the judgment keeps getting postponed?

Robert Schussel   |September.02.2008 The SF chronicle had an article this morning showing that crime is up in the entire Bay area. Mr. Garcia should have checked other jurisdictions before blaming the problem on fewer police in Vallejo.

Firebug   |September.02.2008 Wow speak of self-serving, did anyone read the propaganda piece in the TH rag this morning on Deputy Seth Garcia's view of crime in Vallejo? http://www.timesheraldonline.com/ci_10361775 "I feel really bad for what these guys are going through. This is a busy town, and it's just getting busier," said Garcia, a 28-year veteran of the Solano County Sheriff's Office. "They have lost 30 experienced guys who worked their hearts out here." Here we go with out funding for non-profits, have outrageous fees, closed libraries and some of the worst roads in the Bay Area and he feels sorry for VPD!

Tom Bosley   |September.01.2008 On Fire....thanks for your explanation, I was really confused. I am glad to see you have all of the internet lingo down so well. Now why don't you get a life. By the way I don't read the times horrid very often, but when I have written to them I have used my name like I do here, however I do enjoy Mr. Brooks when his column appears..I hope this trolling?? didn't provoke you too much.

momster   |September.01.2008 My husband and I were wondering why individuals like to push their titles and place of employment when writing an opinion to the editor. We just located to Vallejo and are noticing that people love their titles in this town. I'm specifically speaking about the individual from the VUSD commenting on Tanner's evaluation.

On Fire   |September.01.2008 Bosley, you seem confused. When people stop responding to a poster, it generally is because they don't choose to feed the trolls. Now it appears that you may be having difficulty with the lingo. Let me help you out. An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial and irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the intention of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion. You and Danny are trolls. Got it mini me? Don't be confused and think you have any power to get people to stop having a discussion over here. We simply move on and leave the trolls in the dust. You don't like what's being discussed here, you can stay at the times horrid where there are plenty of people who you would feel comfortable with. But I notice you never use your pen name there? So who are you posing as on the times horrid or do you only troll here?

Ms.BLoGGer   |September.01.2008 Hey Danny boy, instead of having a blogging debate with people who don't want to talk t you, why don't you have one with someone who signs his name to his comments, Mr. Kenneth Brooks. Now I would say that would be an interesting debate. You know, that whole free speech thing? Mr. Brooks raises some interesting points that would lead to a good discussion between the two of you. http://www.ethicalego.com/vallejo_computers.htm

admin   |September.01.2008 It's September 1st!

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